topic Re: Attn all : same problem over and over again in Operating System - HP-UX

Attn all : same problem over and over again

Alexander M. Ermes — Thu, 27 Jun 2002 13:13:01 GMT

Hi guys and gals.
I have seen this over and over again and i want to shake some of the people awake again.
How is it possible, that there are pople posting 125 ! problems and assign points to SEVEN ?!
I think, this is not a fair deal to the people, who invest time and brains into this.
Do we have to go the way to check first, who assigns points on a regular base and who not and then think about helping ?
I will not go this way, but perhaps some people now wake up.
Rgds
Alexander M. Ermes

Re: Attn all : same problem over and over again

Stefan Farrelly — Thu, 27 Jun 2002 13:15:54 GMT

Time to name and shame them. Go for it - list some of the baddies...I would like to see who they are.

Re: Attn all : same problem over and over again

Pete Randall — Thu, 27 Jun 2002 13:16:52 GMT

An often debated question with no real answer. Occasional reminders like this may help some but there are many who just get their answer and run - unfortunately. The effort expended to help just has to be reward enough some times.

Pete

Re: Attn all : same problem over and over again

Justo Exposito — Thu, 27 Jun 2002 13:21:21 GMT

Yes, the same problem again and again and again.

That's the life...

Not is a easy question to solve, we must to learn to live with this folks...:-(

Regards,

Justo.

Re: Attn all : same problem over and over again

PIYUSH D. PATEL — Thu, 27 Jun 2002 13:22:04 GMT

Hi,

A WARNING SHOULD BE DISPLAYED WHEN THE USER WHO HAS POSTED THE QUESTION OPENS THE THREAD TO SEE THE ANSWERS.

" PLEASE ASSIGN APPROPRIATE POINTS FOR THE ANSWERS GIVEN "

CAN HP DO THIS ???

PIYUSH

Re: Attn all : same problem over and over again

Stefan Saliba — Thu, 27 Jun 2002 13:24:04 GMT

I agree fully with what you say. I must say that in my profile one can see that I did not give points to all the people. I really wish to fix this. In the early days one had to assign points one by one which made it very slow. With the new enhancment one can give multiple marks at the same time which is KEWL.

What I suggest is that a percentage appears near the person who posts showing how many questions he assigned points to. If he has a low percenatge then he will not be helped.

Just an idea ,

Good luck

Stefan

Re: Attn all : same problem over and over again

Pete Randall — Thu, 27 Jun 2002 13:24:32 GMT

Speaking of name and shame, here's a thought, maybe Procura could post a list of the worst assigners to Dan's "monthly issues" post, similar to his top 100 list that gets posted to Dan's "monthly successes" post!

Re: Attn all : same problem over and over again

Martin Johnson — Thu, 27 Jun 2002 13:31:33 GMT

I try to assign point to all my replies. I am 7 for 7 right now.

Marty

Re: Attn all : same problem over and over again

Holger Knoppik — Thu, 27 Jun 2002 13:51:05 GMT

Hi Alex,

yeah, to say it in the Ignite-UX language: "GO!" I thougt about to change my personal forum quote from "party on!" to something l??ke "Assign points or stay outside!" Sounds a bit like harry d brown jr has: live free or die! Maybe Dan and his crew can develop some tools to kick off those users and make the forums inaccessible for them.

I went a bit around thru the web and had a look at Steven Sim Kok Leongs Search engine for unassigned points in the itrc. Steven: Great stuff!

Surely, it is not easy to get a 100% ratio, but i think it's not the problem to take a little time to assign some points. It is nice to earn points, but i think the main thing is to sort out which reply was a good solution and which not. Also the forums ettiquette guideline from patrick wallek was really cool.

0 pts here.

RGDS, Holger

Re: Attn all : same problem over and over again

John Bolene — Thu, 27 Jun 2002 14:09:47 GMT

I gave up on this problem many moons ago.
I used to put in my answers -> If this answer has been of any help, please assign points.

That did not even work.

Some folks just don't want to spend any time giving a few carrots or bunnys to those who have taken the effort to reply to their questions.

Some say thanks with points, some say thanks with points and reply what actually solved their problem.

Some don't do anything but read the answers.

There are givers and takers in this world, fact of life, can't do anything to change them.

Re: Attn all : same problem over and over again

Jeff Schussele — Thu, 27 Jun 2002 14:22:33 GMT

Hi Alexander,

I, too have given up & really don't care if they assign points or not. I just answer...hopefully correctly :^)
The points seem to come.

My Grandpa, bless his soul, used to say...
"Kid you can fix a lot of things...but you can't fix stupid."

MOST forumers are good people & do assign points. I won't let the few "hit & runners" spoil my outlook on the rest.
Folks, Please don't let that happen to you.

Cheers,
Jeff

Re: Attn all : same problem over and over again

John Poff — Thu, 27 Jun 2002 14:31:25 GMT

So what is the real problem here? That you are answering questions and not getting points? I say, get over it. Some people are great about assigning points. Some people don't assign points until they get educated on how things are done here, and then they start doing it. Some people just don't assign points and they never will, and there isn't much you can do about it. Do you want to start banning or limiting people who don't assign points? There goes part of what makes this forum great. Anyone can come here for help and get it. Some of the people that never assign points are also the same people that come up with the most interesting problems.

I quit worrying about it a long time ago. The points are meaningless. They are fun when you get them, but they are meaningless. I get my satisfaction from seeing something I haven't considered before and coming up with a reasonable answer. I don't get any more money for getting points and funny hats. My wife thinks it is nice when I tell her I reached another level on the ITRC, but that's about it.

The points are supposed to help people figure out which answers are helpful. Well, I've seen zero points assigned to fantastic answers, and ten points assigned to answers that would bring down your system. What is the answer? Buyer beware. If you have a problem and you are responsible for the system, you had better find out if you are doing the right thing before you do it, and that means you aren't relying on some silly bunny rabbit next to the answer to tell you to try it. Read the man pages. Search all the answers. If you are the kind of person that just wants the right answer and you don't care why it is right, you will get burned.

That's all I have to say about the matter. Now, let's go help somebody.

JP

Re: Attn all : same problem over and over again

steven Burgess_2 — Thu, 27 Jun 2002 14:37:15 GMT

Hi

I do look at a persons profile and if they are newcomers advise them that they can assign points if they wish to those who have helped them as a sign of gratitude. This does generally tend to get recognised as most peolple are grateful for the time that people have spent helping them. Thats all you can do.

Steve

Re: Attn all : same problem over and over again

Ron Cornwell — Thu, 27 Jun 2002 14:52:20 GMT

The problem here is not only that people do not assign points, but that people actually care more about accumulating these points more than helping out a fellow Sys Admin. I thought that the point system was originally put into place to allow the person that asked the question to weigh the validity of the answers that were recieved from their question.

My question is "Do you really new a reward of some kind to help others?"

Re: Attn all : same problem over and over again

Alexander M. Ermes — Thu, 27 Jun 2002 15:25:08 GMT

Hi everybody.
Ooops, i did not know, that i started an avalanche of answers like this.
I do not care about collecting points, what i dislike is people just taking and no giving.
Let's keep it the way Patrick has given.
Rgds
Alexander M. Ermes

Re: Attn all : same problem over and over again

Byron Myers — Thu, 27 Jun 2002 15:33:47 GMT

Whenever I post questions, I welcome all responses - but I usually give more weight to the responses by higher ranks (Wizards, Royalty, etc.). After all, it's these folks that typically have the most experience. From this perspective, points are important.

Re: Attn all : same problem over and over again

Nick Wickens — Thu, 27 Jun 2002 15:38:35 GMT

Ask yourself the question "If there was no points system would I still post a reply"

I think that in the vast majority of cases most people would still offer help as they do on other IT forums without a points system simply because of the type of people IT admins are. Its that primevil instinct of "hey I know something you don't and to prove it heres the answer".

What I would find more satisfying is a final post from the author saying "yep that solved it - thanks" which is also better for future "searchers" on the forum who would like to know if and which solution given had the correct answer. The answers being awarded 10 points are not always the answer that solved the problem.

Re: Attn all : same problem over and over again

Patrick Wessel — Fri, 28 Jun 2002 07:29:46 GMT

I never participated in a discussion like this before, because I thought that someone who doesn't bother to search for an answer and doesn't bother to assign points won't read it anyway.
But, there is something I would like to add. Maybe it's frustrating to have some users who don't show appropriate appreciation and 'consume' the forums instead of participate in them. What I feel is much more frustrating is the behavior when someone gives every answer one or two points and walks away. Why doesn't he/she tell us why the answers didn't satisfy him/her? It happens sometimes to me that I misunderstand a question and so I give a technical correct answer, but doesn't hit the core of the question. In those cases is it pretty helpful to know why you get a low rating.

Re: Attn all : same problem over and over again

Tom Geudens — Fri, 28 Jun 2002 08:20:00 GMT

Hi,
Personnally I'm not going to stop helping because someone does not award points. However, I do believe in an ongoing campaign to make people "aware" of the point-system (you'd be surprised how many people do - for example - not know that you've got to be logged in to award points).
I think we should push to integrate the "etiquette"-document and the "replys without points awarded"-pages into the forum proper (yes, I do know there's a link to the "etiquette"-document ... but I usually jump directly into the forums ... and I think most people do).

Byron, I do not really agree with the weight you give to the hats. I know I myself occasionally completely miss the point and I've - a lot more frequently - been given excelent information by people without hats.
Not everyone can spend the same amount of time in the forums. It's true an answer by an Olympian / Pharaoh / Royal can be based on a lot of experience (in and outside of the forums) but an answer of a non-hatter can also be based on a lot of experience (outside of the forums).

Regards,
Tom

Re: Attn all : same problem over and over again

Chris Wilshaw — Fri, 28 Jun 2002 09:35:56 GMT

I suppose the points question comes down to the reason that people want to use the forums in the first place. I suspect that most of us are members, so that we can give and receive help as required - and would almost certainly do so, even if the points system was not in place. This probably stems from the fact that we're mostly employed in support roles, so it's just a simple extension of what we already do. At a simple level, would you stop resetting a users password, just because they called you every day to do this, and never said thanks? Probably not - you'd do it just to keep things running smoothly.

Another aspect to consider is that just because one person doesn't assign points (for whatever reason) to an answer, doesn't mean it's wrong, or of now use - other people could be carrying out a search for just that problem (I know that I've done this) or they could just be browsing to see what's available, and think of a way that they could apply an answer to their environment.

The forums aren't just a Q+A medium, they're a vast (almost living) knowledge archive.