topic Re: BACKUP/CREATE/BEFORE/SINCE problem in Operating System - OpenVMS

BACKUP/CREATE/BEFORE/SINCE problem

Lawrence Czlapinski — Mon, 24 Oct 2005 12:48:14 GMT

OS: OpenVMS Alpha 7.3-1
backup/replace/rewind backup_tape_1:liv_disk_1.bck/sav/created/since=3-oct-2005/BEF=4-OCT-2005/sele=[maint.alm.output] dsa1:[maint.alm.output.2005-10-03...]/by_own=parent
DATA REQUEST for files between 3-OCT-2005 and 4-OCT-2005.
DESIRED RESULT: Restore only files created between 3-OCT-2005 and 4-OCT-2005
ACTUAL RESULT: Restored all files from the directory tree.
COMMENTS: Some files have version limits. Fortunately I restored to another directory since this is a production system.
I haven't tried it on VMS 7.3-2. I dont' have any VMS 8.x systems.
Lawrence

Re: BACKUP/CREATE/BEFORE/SINCE problem

Travis Craig — Mon, 24 Oct 2005 13:20:07 GMT

Lawrence,

In the System Management Utilities Reference Manual, I see that it differentiates between qualifiers that apply to input files and those that apply to input save-sets. /SINCE applies to input files, so I suspect that means it applies only when you are copying files into a save-set or from one directory tree to another.

I guess the (rather annoying) work-around would be to recover the whole save-set and then copy the files from the dates you want.

--Travis Craig

Re: BACKUP/CREATE/BEFORE/SINCE problem

Lawrence Czlapinski — Mon, 24 Oct 2005 13:40:54 GMT

1. Both /BEFORE and /SINCE are valid BACKUP input file selection qualifiers. Apparently you can't use both together. Why not?
2. It could have been a disaster if I had restored to the original directory and interfered with production.
Lawrence

Re: BACKUP/CREATE/BEFORE/SINCE problem

Lawrence Czlapinski — Mon, 24 Oct 2005 13:51:55 GMT

This is a restore from a full backup. We didn't have an incremental from that far back.
Lawrence

Re: BACKUP/CREATE/BEFORE/SINCE problem

Hein van den Heuvel — Mon, 24 Oct 2005 14:07:36 GMT

Hmm,

It seems to so me that the answer Travis gave was correct, useful, and courteous. It even had a potential workaround.

However, Travis was assigned 1 point. Why?

Are you out of points? I'll be happy to give you some! :-)

Or was the answer perhaps correct, but not the desired one?

[ 0 points for this part of the reply is just fine :-) ]

Anyway...

I agree with both of you that
a) /since would be a useful, meaningful Input Save-Set Qualifier
b) The help file is too subtle distinguishing "Input Save-Set Qualifier" and "Input File-Selection Qualifier"
c) It should possibly not just ignore the /SINCE but fail the command altogether.

If those observations are correct then I would recommend a support call/Email requesting a documentation and/or code improvement for backup.

Cheers,
Hein.

Re: BACKUP/CREATE/BEFORE/SINCE problem

Lawrence Czlapinski — Mon, 24 Oct 2005 15:50:53 GMT

Travis: Please post again. I'm afraid Hein is correct in that you gave a correct answer. I just didn't like the answer although it was an excellent response by you.
1. Restoring a whole saveset (whole disk) might not be practical if the disk is 80% or more full which is often the case. And no they won't buy us larger disks just because a disk fills up.
2. Fortunately the data request was only for one directory. So I created a 2nd directory copied the files with the appropriate /BEFORE/SINCE qualifiers as you suggested. Deleted the files from the original directory I created. Then COPY/REPLACE the files. The /REPLACE is necessary because of multiple versions.
Hein:
1. Yes, the answer was correct but not the desired one.
2. I had missed the "File-Selection". So the documentation is correct but subtle.
3. Yes, it should fail the /BEFORE and /SINCE commands since they aren't valid for a tape saveset input but hopefully with a decent error message.
4. Yes, it would make a good code improvement.
Lawrence

Re: BACKUP/CREATE/BEFORE/SINCE problem

Hein van den Heuvel — Mon, 24 Oct 2005 16:09:17 GMT

[I googled for an Email for Lawrence, but failed to find one, so I'll just reply here]

Excellent reply. Thanks for the clarification Lawrence!

My point assignment remarks were just an observation. Nothing personal. Thanks for the topic. It was a good reminder/warning on this backup behavior.

Cheers,
Hein.

Re: BACKUP/CREATE/BEFORE/SINCE problem

Travis Craig — Mon, 24 Oct 2005 22:21:38 GMT

Lawrence,

It looks as though everything is clarified now. My experiment included only a /since, and even that didn't work. I'm surprised that Backup hasn't been modified over the years to include date-based selections from save-sets, because this can't be the first time someone has needed one. I would have assumed it would work the way you tried, too.

I guess when disk space is short then you need to make extensive use of the /select qualifier to get the files you want. What a pain! Not to mention time consuming if it means doing a bunch of Backup commands from tape.

--Travis

Re: BACKUP/CREATE/BEFORE/SINCE problem

Ian Miller. — Tue, 25 Oct 2005 03:20:21 GMT

Parhaps the Save Set Manager product would help in selecting subsets of backup savesets?

Re: BACKUP/CREATE/BEFORE/SINCE problem

Lawrence Czlapinski — Tue, 25 Oct 2005 10:37:02 GMT

Ian: It might but the company won't buy it. My time is paid for.
Lawrence

Re: BACKUP/CREATE/BEFORE/SINCE problem

Lawrence Czlapinski — Tue, 25 Oct 2005 10:40:18 GMT

Travis' answer solved the immediate problem with the workaround.
Lawrence