topic Re: gSOAP on OpenVMS in Operating System - OpenVMS

gSOAP on OpenVMS

John McL — Wed, 21 Jan 2009 05:44:04 GMT

We're looking to use gSOAP built with SSL on an OpenVMS system. Does anyone know where I can download the installation kit or better yet, a version with SSL support compiled for Alpha? TIA.

Re: gSOAP on OpenVMS

Robert Gezelter — Wed, 21 Jan 2009 11:03:09 GMT

I believe that you will find some information on this subject at:

http://johndapps.blogspot.com/

- Bob Gezelter, http://www.rlgsc.com

Re: gSOAP on OpenVMS

Ramondo — Wed, 21 Jan 2009 22:19:31 GMT

And if you look here, http://www.johndapps.com/gSOAP-kit-notes-AXP-02.pdf, (note there's separate Alpha and Itanium kits and documents) in section 7:

"SSL is not currently supported; however such support can probably be incorporated with relatively little effort."

I believe this is specific to the OpenVMS port of gSOAP. It would probably be best to contact the authors directly.

Re: gSOAP on OpenVMS

John McL — Wed, 21 Jan 2009 23:01:42 GMT

Thanks Bob and Ramondo but we've already found that information. I was hoping that someone had already built gSOAP with SSL for VMS. The docs from John Apps say that it will probably be easy but I'm worried, if it was so easy then why didn't he spend the implied small amount of time on trying it? I have emailed the 3 HP guys that wrote the note on John Apps's blog. maybe they can tell us more about it.

I'm still hopeful of a packaged solution or someone who can tell us how to do it.

Re: gSOAP on OpenVMS

Hoff — Thu, 22 Jan 2009 00:01:49 GMT

I'd try it. If the docs are wrong here with what is implied (or what was inferred?), then there is some fodder (and some error messages) that we can look at, and fodder for some mail messages.

Go try the build. Build a package or an installer, and go build some experience for yourself. With the way things are, having some experience with digging around in or porting gSOAP et al is probably a good thing.

Don't over-think this open-source stuff. :-)

With what is going on at HP and at other many places, there's enough work that the SSL stuff may well have been a "yeah, that's nice, but..." case. There's more than enough stuff that folks are seeking to have ported.

Or (if you really need it and don't want to deal with the port) retain somebody to port and package it for you.

This is how open source works, after all...

Re: gSOAP on OpenVMS

Steven Schweda — Thu, 22 Jan 2009 04:14:56 GMT

> [...] if it was so easy [...]

Easier if you know how, but everything's
complicated. I'd expect some fiddling with
a "config.h" (or equivalent) somewhere, to
persuade the code that SSL is available at
compile time, and then some changes to the
LINK command(s) to get the SSL stuff into the
executable(s).

If you're desperate for some examples, wget
(optionally) uses SSL. Details differ for
HP's SSL with its shared images, and OpenSSL
with its object libraries.

http://antinode.info/dec/sw/wget.html

Re: gSOAP on OpenVMS

Ramondo — Thu, 22 Jan 2009 04:52:48 GMT

John,

In case you haven't seen it, this is the "generic" gSOAP user guide I was looking for earlier. It has SSL information on sections 18.19 to 18.24
http://www.cs.fsu.edu/~engelen/soapdoc2.html

I'm still at an evaluation stage with the OpenVMS version of gSOAP and haven't had the requirement for SSL (yet).

Re: gSOAP on OpenVMS

John McL — Thu, 22 Jan 2009 04:55:56 GMT

Hoff, we've taken a look at trying to build it ourselves without any help but the downloaded zip file of sources (from http://www.cs.fsu.edu/~engelen/soap.html) expanded into over 1100 files, many (like 30 or more) with filenames that were incompatibale with OpenVMS.

In essence we'd be trying to build Linux sources on VMS but we'd have to somehow convert the Linux makefile because it's not currently compatible with VMS.

It's not looking good at the moment.

Re: gSOAP on OpenVMS

John McL — Thu, 22 Jan 2009 05:03:07 GMT

Ramondo, thanks but that's what we've already found and are getting frustrated with.

Re: gSOAP on OpenVMS

Robert Gezelter — Thu, 22 Jan 2009 11:12:27 GMT

John,

A question: Was the gSOAP kit restored to an ODS-2 or ODS-5 volume?

Since John did not include the source tree in the gSOAP kit, I suspect (but have not confirmed with him) that the source tree naming was likely unaffected.

One of the "pleasures" of Open Source is that most proponents will advocate that one should have to compile things on their own [an opinion that I do not share, but one sometimes has to accept the limitations of the medium].

As Hoff already noted, retaining someone to package the components into a kit form is an option (Disclosure: We provide such services, as do Hoff and others).

- Bob Gezelter, http://www.rlgsc.com

Re: gSOAP on OpenVMS

John McL — Fri, 23 Jan 2009 00:57:17 GMT

Bob, we're tried extracting the gSOAP kit onto an ODS-5 disk and at the moment we're still struggling with it.

My colleague, who I am posting these message for because I have an ITR account, says that what we're trying to do is the opposite to normal - we want to set things up for outbound messages rather than for inbound messages (or should my vice be versa?).

The guys who wrote the docs on John Apps's blog have responded to my email and we'll discuss things in more detail with them next week.

Re: gSOAP on OpenVMS

Robert Gezelter — Fri, 23 Jan 2009 05:11:44 GMT

John,

What precisely is the problem that you are having with unzippping the archive?

- Bob Gezelter, http://www.rlgsc.com

Re: gSOAP on OpenVMS

John McL — Tue, 27 Jan 2009 23:25:05 GMT

Bob, the unzipping had some problems with the ancient version of tar that we had on VMS, then the file names had to go to an ODS-5 disk because they were Unix format rather than VMS. Then when we got makefile on VMS running it wanted to use yacc and bison (I think).

We've spoken with the guys who did the work for John Apps's website and they'll do some more work and get back to us in a few days. When they do I'll try to get some useful info posted back here for everyone to read.

At the moment I'm not sure what public comments they want to make about what they're doing, or precisely what it is they will do (e.g. a PCSI installation kit or a zipped kit, something that HP will support or something it won't, a kit that needs external components x, y and z or a kit that has everything, whether they're happy to have me post something or whether they want to do it themselves.)

Re: gSOAP on OpenVMS

Steven Schweda — Wed, 28 Jan 2009 04:50:46 GMT

> [...] ancient version of tar [...]

If you're feeling adventurous:

http://antinode.info/ftp/vmstar/v3r5_pre3_src.zip

Re: gSOAP on OpenVMS

Richard J Maher — Wed, 28 Jan 2009 06:01:49 GMT

Hi John,

>>>>>>>>>
We've spoken with the guys who did the work for John Apps's website and they'll do some more work and get back to us in a few days.
<<<<<<<<<

"Free-Time permitting" surely?

Given what's happening to many VMS engineers I'd hate to think the less-worthy were still raking it in for twiddling their thumbs.

Regards Richard Maher

Re: gSOAP on OpenVMS

Richard J Maher — Fri, 30 Jan 2009 07:24:38 GMT

Hi John,

Just looking at http://ws.apache.org/axis2/c/
recently, and was wondering if the built-in and fully-supported SSL capability of Axis2 would satisfy your requirements?

Also can't see a distinction on the HP site between the JAVA and C versions of Axis2: -
http://h71000.www7.hp.com/openvms/products/ips/axis2/

But there is: - "Axis2 for OpenVMS provides a complete port of the Apache Axis2 1.3 project."

So if it isn't there I guess it's gotta be around the corner?

Regards Richard Maher

Re: gSOAP on OpenVMS

John McL — Wed, 04 Feb 2009 22:07:09 GMT

Sorry about the delay.

We're waiting on the HP guys to get back to us, at which point we'll discuss what I can say in this forum regards their progress and any ongoing support for gSOAP SSL.

Our issue with SSL is not at the server end so issues with Apache don't apply. We currently have a workaround of bouncing a message to a machine that can do the SSL communication with the server but we'd be happier with a gSOAP SSL to allow us to directly communicate with that server.

Re: gSOAP on OpenVMS

Richard J Maher — Thu, 05 Feb 2009 11:53:34 GMT

Hi John,

> Our issue with SSL is not at the server

Ok.

> end so issues with Apache don't apply.

Is that what "the HP guys" have told you?

My understanding is that Axis2 provides mechanisms to both "provide and *consume*" SOAP services; maybe you're right?

Look, I've not used the software in anger so I'm happy to be corrected, but what I can see from: -

http://ws.apache.org/axis2/1_2/Axis2ArchitectureGuide.html

"Provide a Client API that can be used to invoke Web services. This API should support both the Synchronous and Asynchronous programming models. "

http://h71000.www7.hp.com/openvms/products/ips/soap/soap.html

"The SOAP Toolkit is Java-based and provides development tools to create SOAP clients or to implement server-side SOAP accessible services using HTTP as the transport protocol. As a client library, it provides the ability to invoke SOAP RPC services available elsewhere, in addition to features for sending and receiving SOAP messages."

http://h71000.www7.hp.com/openvms/products/ips/axis2/
"Axis2 for OpenVMS replaces the SOAP Toolkit for OpenVMS. All future new features and enhancements will be provided beginning with Axis2 Version 1.0 for OpenVMS. "

. . .is that Axis2 is where they're heading. Certainly one of the many SOAP implementations they've been pumping millions of license-payer dollars into.

> We currently have a workaround of bouncing
> a message to a machine that can do the SSL
> communication with the server

Maybe Stunnel for VMS can be of some assitance here and don't forget IPSec.

> but we'd be happier with a gSOAP SSL to
> allow us to directly communicate with that
> server

Me, I'd love an XHR$ RTL that can be fully integrated with VMS and it's 3GLs but it don't look like it's gonna happen. "Money for old rope" seems to get the development dollars these days, but as gSOAP is supplanting WSIT and Axis2, could someone just tell the poor fools that are implementing projects with them at the moment? They can't take any more vacilations :-(

> We're waiting on the HP guys to get back
> to us, at which point we'll discuss what
> I can say in this forum regards their
> progress and any ongoing support for
> gSOAP SSL.

I too would very much like to know what's been whispered to VMS customers by "HP guys" all theses years and for what ends!

Depends which "HP guys" you talk to I suppose?

Regards Richard Maher

Re: gSOAP on OpenVMS

John McL — Thu, 05 Feb 2009 22:31:26 GMT

Richard, thanks for your thoughts.

We seem to be making good progress with the 3 guys who originally supplied gSOAP and commented that adding SSL should be easy.

I've asked one of them to post to this thread so that people like yourself are brought up to date.

I would be guessing at what's happenibng between those guys and HP so I can't pre-empt what might be said.

It's Friday here now and if they've not posted by early next week I'll send them a reminder to do so.

Re: gSOAP on OpenVMS

John McL — Sun, 15 Feb 2009 21:52:22 GMT

I'm still waiting for a response from one of the 3 people who ported gSOAP to VMS.

I'll email them a reminder.