topic Re: RemoteDekstop/VNC possible in version 1.2-6? in Operating System - OpenVMS

RemoteDekstop/VNC possible in version 1.2-6?

MathewA — Sun, 14 Jun 2009 10:44:43 GMT

Hi all,

I'm new to OpenVMS but I hope you guys will still help me out :)
I am doing some work on the network environment here and one of the computers is running "Compaq DECWindows Motif for OpenVMS, Version 1.2-6".

I would like to be able to remotely access that computer and access both mouse and keyboard.
On the other Windows and Linux computers I have been using Windows' own RemoteDesktop or a VNC programm.

Now I wondered if it was somehow possible to do the same here or whether maybe the operating system already offered a solution for this.

I hope you gurus know the system and know how to solve this problem.
Any help would be hugely appreciated!

Kind regads,
Mathew

Re: RemoteDekstop/VNC possible in version 1.2-6?

marsh_1 — Sun, 14 Jun 2009 10:56:02 GMT

HI,

try using an x-windows emulator like reflections for example to access decwindows via telnet or ssh. there is also a vnc client for vms - just google for openvms vnc.

hth

Re: RemoteDekstop/VNC possible in version 1.2-6?

MathewA — Sun, 14 Jun 2009 11:33:47 GMT

I found a ported version of TighVNC but that requires perl and "a recent version of X" ;)

at least according to the readme.

I also found references to a vnc version for openvms by Hunter Goatley but a) it was only for the newer openvms versions and b) i could only find the release notes and no working download locations.

Transfering data from the computer to the ftp server is not the problem by the way. All I need to do is "see" the desktop like with VNC or RemoteDekstop and control the mouse and keyboard.

Re: RemoteDekstop/VNC possible in version 1.2-6?

marsh_1 — Sun, 14 Jun 2009 12:05:17 GMT

hi,

which alpha or vax system is this and what is the version of vms ?
what is the reason for needing a windowing type session ?

hth

Re: RemoteDekstop/VNC possible in version 1.2-6?

Steven Schweda — Sun, 14 Jun 2009 14:07:01 GMT

> I would like to be able to remotely access
> that computer and access both mouse and
> keyboard.

That probably requires a robot.

As usual, it's often more helpful to specify
what the actual problem is, or what task
you're trying to perform, rather than asking
how to implement a particular (non-ideal)
solution to that problem.

What you _can_ do easily is what you can do
with many non-Windows systems, and that is to
use the X Window System (here, DECwindows) to
let you run a program on the VMS system and
have it use your X server to provide
keyboard+pointer input, and graphical display
output.

There may be a working VNC viewer for VMS,
but I've never heard of a working VNC
_server_ for VMS, and that's what you'd need
to control the VMS system remotely. (Right?)

There are lots of X server kits available for
Windows. (Or get a Mac, or use a Linux
desktop system with X installed.)

Re: RemoteDekstop/VNC possible in version 1.2-6?

Hoff — Sun, 14 Jun 2009 14:08:05 GMT

http://fafner.dyndns.org/~alexey/

Re: RemoteDekstop/VNC possible in version 1.2-6?

MathewA — Sun, 14 Jun 2009 16:20:20 GMT

Apologies if I did not make myself clear :(

What I am trying to do is remotely use the computer.

Meaning, the computer with OpenVMS (details like version were posted in first post) is in building A. My computer is in building B.

Now I do not want to walk over to building A to start a calculation or a measurement (openvms computer controls a measuring device) or check whether the calculations are actually done yet.
So just like in VNC tools like TightVNC, UltraVNC etc I would like to be able to open a connection that mirrors the video output of the computer in building A to my desktop on my computer in building B and allows me to virtually use the mouse and keyboard as well.

That way I do not need to actually use the actual keyboard and mouse but can control the whole computer from Building B or even from home.

I do the same with other computers. e.g. the ftp server is running on Windows and remotedesktop (that's what it's called in german) is activated.
I can then log on to that computer via the internet and virtually use the mouse and keyboard and control the computer as if i were standing in front of it using the actual mouse and keyboard hardware.

Re: RemoteDekstop/VNC possible in version 1.2-6?

marsh_1 — Sun, 14 Jun 2009 16:46:26 GMT

hi,

then you should just need to use an x-window emulator from your pc , that will give you the same sort of decwindows screen you would see locally, access will depend whether this system has ip services like telnet or ssh enabled.
the version you have given is for the x-window type software thats runs on openvms called decwindows , the operating system version will be different to that.

fwiw

Re: RemoteDekstop/VNC possible in version 1.2-6?

MathewA — Sun, 14 Jun 2009 18:13:49 GMT

all i could find is that it is running DECTerm and then I found "Compaq DECWindows Motif for OpenVMS, Version 1.2-6".

if you can tell me where to look I would happily supply you with any information I can :)

you wouldn't by any chance have a short manual or could post the commands i need to enter in the DECWindows command prompt to start the necessary software or check whether it is installed?

i just downloaded and installed both XMing and Cygwin. hope those are sufficient.

Re: RemoteDekstop/VNC possible in version 1.2-6?

Hoff — Sun, 14 Jun 2009 20:15:58 GMT

Here's how to establish and manage remote displays with ssh port forwarding to a Mac OS X box; Unix and Linux boxes are similar.

http://labs.hoffmanlabs.com/node/134

There are discussions of X11 and VNC there, as well as the sequence used to raise an X Window display on the local box.

Re: RemoteDekstop/VNC possible in version 1.2-6?

Steven Schweda — Sun, 14 Jun 2009 21:27:45 GMT

> So just like in VNC tools like TightVNC,
> UltraVNC etc I would like to [...]

Ok. Without a VNC server, which I believe is
not available, I don't think that you can do
that. You can do many other things, some of
which may be close enough.

You can run a terminal emulator on the remote
system, and use Telnet, RSH, SSH, or whatever
to connect to the VMS system, and get an
interactive terminal session.

With an X server on the remote system, you
can do all pretty much anything you could do
if you were sitting at a graphics console at
the VMS system: DECterm session, Web browser,
EDIT/TPU /INTERFACE=DECWINDOWS, ... --
anything with a DECwindows interface.

What you probably can _not_ do is start an
interactive session of some kind locally on
the VMS system, and then operate that session
remotely (which VNC _could_ let you do).

> [...] start a calculation or a measurement
> (openvms computer controls a measuring
> device) or check whether the calculations
> are actually done yet. [...]

These may seem like well-defined tasks to
you, but I don't know enough about how you
"start a [...] measurement" or "check" on one
to suggest exactly how you might best be able
to do such things from a distance. In some
cases, it's helpful to submit a task as a
batch job, so it can run non-interactively,
and then its progress (log file, completion
status, and so on) can be checked from
anywhere.

It might be interesting to know exactly what
this VMS system is (actual model, workstation
or server, something), and how you normally
interact with it (VT100, some other terminal
or terminal emulator, workstation graphics
console, ...).

Re: RemoteDekstop/VNC possible in version 1.2-6?

marsh_1 — Sun, 14 Jun 2009 22:02:29 GMT

hi,

it sounds like you've found decterm on the local graphics console ? fire up a decterm session and at the $ prompt ( or any whatever the command prompt has been configured to) enter

show sys/proc=decw*

that will show you any decwindows processes running on the system and will also display the vms version at the top.
if you enter

ucx show version
ucx show serv
ucx show inter

that will show you the version of tcpip , the tcpip services running on the system and the ip addresses you can use to get to it.

show cpu/full

will show you the cpu type/speed and also the system type
get all of that into a txt file and attach it to your next post.

fwiw

Re: RemoteDekstop/VNC possible in version 1.2-6?

MathewA — Mon, 15 Jun 2009 04:26:00 GMT

@mark hunt: i will do that first thing tomorrow. i'll report back on the versions and details.

@Steven Schweda: i truly hope you are wrong :(

measurements are started by opening the measuring software and then adjusting and starting it. it has a gui so it's status cannot just be checked via command prompt.

hence the need to actually "see" what is running on the computer just like in VNC.

the software would be started and executed locally and i then want to monitor it remotely.
so i would need to see the same output i would see on the computer's monitor. not just be able to execute new programs and commands. i need to see the window of already active programs.

Re: RemoteDekstop/VNC possible in version 1.2-6?

Steven Schweda — Mon, 15 Jun 2009 05:16:40 GMT

> @Steven Schweda: i truly hope you are wrong :(

You can hope, but the "just like in VNC" part
sounds bad to me.

> [...] it's status [...]

That's "its status".

Re: RemoteDekstop/VNC possible in version 1.2-6?

MathewA — Mon, 15 Jun 2009 06:13:34 GMT

>That's "its status".

true. mea culpa. my german's better though ;)

Re: RemoteDekstop/VNC possible in version 1.2-6?

Joseph Huber_1 — Mon, 15 Jun 2009 06:42:38 GMT

>>
so i would need to see the same output i would see on the computer's monitor. not just be able to execute new programs and commands. i need to see the window of already active programs.
>>
This is what Windows remote Desktop is doing, just redirecting the complete I/O (display,keyboard,pointer,audio) from the local desktop to the remote, all running programs being undisturbed, not terminated and restarted.
The X11 access method (VMS or Unix like systems) does not offer this capability.
A remote X11 session has no connection to the desktop on the local system.
So either the application on the local desktop has to be aware of the remote display (e.g. by sending a command telling it to use the new X11 display), or it has to be stopped and restarted on the remote X11 desktop.
Applications designed for X11 (VMS or Unix) usually separate data-acquisition from data-presentation and control interface, so they can run ob different desktops (or no desktop at all).

Re: RemoteDekstop/VNC possible in version 1.2-6?

marsh_1 — Mon, 15 Jun 2009 09:30:17 GMT

hi,

given your clarification on your needs here - as joseph has pointed out an x-window emulator won't do this, you are back to the vnc server port that hoff posted a link to earlier.

hth

Re: RemoteDekstop/VNC possible in version 1.2-6?

Brian Reiter — Mon, 15 Jun 2009 09:58:06 GMT

Could the measuring software be run from a PC running the X-windows server?

You could then use VNC onto that PC (assuming of course it all plays nicely) and tweak the software like that.

Re: RemoteDekstop/VNC possible in version 1.2-6?

Joseph Huber_1 — Mon, 15 Jun 2009 10:19:38 GMT

I think VNC is also on VMS doing almost what You need.

But be aware:
>>Compaq DECWindows Motif for OpenVMS, Version 1.2-6 <<
indicates a VMS version older than 7.3-2.
At least Alexei's VNC server requires at least VMS 8.2 !
So a VMS upgrade on Mathew's system will be necessary.

Re: RemoteDekstop/VNC possible in version 1.2-6?

MathewA — Mon, 15 Jun 2009 15:01:34 GMT

yes, the system is a few years old and i doubt anyone before me ever really tried to get it to be all that it could be :)

i honestly do not know whether i could install a different operating system. i will have to talk to the manufacturer as i do not know whether the drivers and programs need would be available for newer operating systems.

i'll check with them because anything short of what VNC does (redirect the whole I/O) would not be sufficient, i'm afraid.