topic VMS - change from EDT to EST - have question about daylight_savings.com in Operating System - OpenVMS

VMS - change from EDT to EST - have question about daylight_savings.com

Layne Burleson_1 — Mon, 08 Nov 2004 11:12:52 GMT

When I use sys$examples:daylight_savings.com, I have no problem converting from eastern daylight to eastern standard. However, when I do the reverse by changing from standard to daylight, the following 2 logicals do not get changed: SYS$TIMEZONE_DAYLIGHT_SAVINGS and SYS$TIMEZONE_NAME. They remained the same and should have changed. I'm on Alpha DS10 running OpenVMS 7.3-1 fully patched.... does anyone have a better method for time change. We do not run DTSS and can't turn on the automatic time change system parameter due to manufacturing schedules.

Re: VMS - change from EDT to EST - have question about daylight_savings.com

Volker Halle — Mon, 08 Nov 2004 12:01:43 GMT

Layne,

looks like the new (E8.2) DAYLIGHT_SAVINGS.COM now also resets the 3 logicals:

$! SYS$TIMEZONE_DAYLIGHT_SAVING
$! SYS$TIMEZONE_NAME
$! SYS$TIMEZONE_RULE

by invoking @SYS$MANAGER:UTC$TIME_SETUP "" RULE

Volker.

Re: VMS - change from EDT to EST - have question about daylight_savings.com

Ian Miller. — Mon, 08 Nov 2004 12:31:40 GMT

Do you have NET$DISABLE_DTSS defined to be true?

I seem to remember reading somewhere that this should be defined explictly as well has not having dtss installed due to a check for it in a command file somewhere.

Re: VMS - change from EDT to EST - have question about daylight_savings.com

Layne Burleson_1 — Mon, 08 Nov 2004 12:38:11 GMT

Ian,
No I don't have that defined. I just tried it out prior to running a the procedure and I get the same results.
Layne

Re: VMS - change from EDT to EST - have question about daylight_savings.com

Volker Halle — Mon, 08 Nov 2004 13:56:15 GMT

Layne,

from reading the E8.2 DAYLIGHT_SETTINGS.COM, you should do the following:

Just try to run @SYS$MANAGER:UTC$TIME_SETUP "" RULE
after @DAYLIGHT_SETTINGS.COM - this is the last line added to DST$CHANGE.COM in the E8.2 version.

As far as I'm aware, the only 'supported' way to disable DTSS is via DEF/SYSTEM NET$DISABLE_DTSS in SYLOGICALS.COM

Volker.

Re: VMS - change from EDT to EST - have question about daylight_savings.com

Layne Burleson_1 — Mon, 08 Nov 2004 14:08:19 GMT

Volker-
I'm on 7.3-1, not Eval 8.2..... I need something that I can run in batch mode to change the information. I can pass in parameters to the daylight_savings.com, but I"m not sure what to pass to the other you recommended.
Layne

Re: VMS - change from EDT to EST - have question about daylight_savings.com

Martin P.J. Zinser — Mon, 08 Nov 2004 18:07:24 GMT

Hello Layne,

I think you misunderstood Volker. He does not (yet ;-) suggest to upgrade to 8.2.

But from looking at the code he sees that the difference between the two is the call to the
@SYS$MANAGER:UTC$TIME_SETUP DCL procedure at the end.

So if you do need to do this in a batch, just execute the two procedures one after another.

Greetings, Martin

Re: VMS - change from EDT to EST - have question about daylight_savings.com

Volker Halle — Tue, 09 Nov 2004 01:54:49 GMT

Layne,

Martin got it right ;-)

I looked at the differences between E8.2 and a previous version of DAYLIGHT_SAVINGS.COM and spotted the comments, which talked about setting those 3 additional logicals in 8.2. And I also found the additional call of @SYS$MANAGER:UTC_TIME_SETUP "" RULE

These changes will appear in the next version of OpenVMS V8.2 and - as this is just a DCL procedure - may be worth testing in your environment as well. If it works for you - and it should (otherwise you can send me a reproducer and I'll happily escalate this via PTR - we're a fieldtest site), then you're happy and we all know it will work for everybody in V8.2.

Volker.

Re: VMS - change from EDT to EST - have question about daylight_savings.com

Layne Burleson_1 — Tue, 09 Nov 2004 08:40:20 GMT

Martin & Volker,
Thanks for the input. Excuse my ignorance, but what parameters are feed into sys$manager:Utc$time_setup. I had a system set to EST with differential of -18000.... I ran the daylight savings job for daylight savings and it set the differential to -14400 which is correct, but did not change any other logicals. I'm not sure what to put in the utc$time_setup for a batch run.

I thought it may be something like @sys$manager:utc$time_setup.com "" "TDF" -240 0 ...... but that did not change the sys$timezone_name or sys$timezone_daylight_saving logical to the correct values.

Re: VMS - change from EDT to EST - have question about daylight_savings.com

Volker Halle — Tue, 09 Nov 2004 09:34:00 GMT

Layne,

I would suggest, that you first try to manually invoke the procedure with the following DCL command:

$ @SYS$MANAGER:UTC$TIME_SETUP "" RULE

after running DAYLIGHT_SAVINGS.COM

If that works for you, you can think of just writing a new small DCL procedure, which invokes both procedures one after the other and submit that one in batch.

If you send me mail, I'll send you the E8.2 version of DAYLIGHT_SAVINGS.COM so you can test the new version yourself. You should be able to guess my mail address from looking at my forum profile...

Volker.

Re: VMS - change from EDT to EST - have question about daylight_savings.com

Layne Burleson_1 — Tue, 09 Nov 2004 13:04:48 GMT

Volker,
I did a difference on the file you sent me and the file I have on 7.3-1. They are the same. I thought that to be rather weird.
Layne

Re: VMS - change from EDT to EST - have question about daylight_savings.com

Martin P.J. Zinser — Tue, 09 Nov 2004 13:56:22 GMT

Hello Layne,

now you made me do it ;-) I've actually looked at the procedure.

The invocation of utc$time_setup.com quoted by
Volker can be used verbatim. RULE is not some
symbol set earlier in the procedure but a keyword expected by utc$time_setup.com.

So go ahead, run it and check if your logicals get defined correclty.

Greetings, Martin

Re: VMS - change from EDT to EST - have question about daylight_savings.com

Layne Burleson_1 — Tue, 09 Nov 2004 15:19:44 GMT

Martin,
I just ran and this is what I get:
$ sho lo *timez*

(LNM$PROCESS_TABLE)

(LNM$JOB_8132F740)

(LNM$GROUP_000001)

(LNM$GROUP_000250)

(LNM$SYSTEM_TABLE)

"SYS$TIMEZONE_DAYLIGHT_SAVING" = "0"
"SYS$TIMEZONE_DIFFERENTIAL" = "-18000"
"SYS$TIMEZONE_NAME" = "EST"
"SYS$TIMEZONE_RULE" = "EST5EDT4,M4.1.0/02,M10.5.0/02"

(LNM$SYSCLUSTER_TABLE)

(DECW$LOGICAL_NAMES)
$ sho time
9-NOV-2004 15:15:54
$ @sys$examples:daylight_savings.com

Are you changing to DAYLIGHT or to STANDARD time? (DAYLIGHT/STANDARD): DAYLIGHT

Will the sysman be on this NODE only or CLUSTER wide? (NODE/CLUSTER): NODE

If you choose to SAVE the procedures, you can modify
the SYSMAN environment, or make other changess before executing.

Do you wish to EXECUTE the change now, QUEUE it for future execution,
or SAVE the created procedures without executing?
(EXECUTE/QUEUE/SAVE): EXECUTE

Created file $1$DKA100:[VMS$COMMON.SYSMGR]DST$CHANGE.COM

Is it O.K. to execute the time sysman now? (Yes/No): YES

Configuring the Time Differential Factor (TDF)

$ @SYS$MANAGER:UTC$TIME_SETUP "" RULE

$ SHO LO *TIMEZ*

(LNM$PROCESS_TABLE)

(LNM$JOB_8132F740)

(LNM$GROUP_000001)

(LNM$GROUP_000250)

(LNM$SYSTEM_TABLE)

"SYS$TIMEZONE_DAYLIGHT_SAVING" = "0"
"SYS$TIMEZONE_DIFFERENTIAL" = "-14400"
"SYS$TIMEZONE_NAME" = "EST"
"SYS$TIMEZONE_RULE" = "EST5EDT4,M4.1.0/02,M10.5.0/02"

(LNM$SYSCLUSTER_TABLE)

(DECW$LOGICAL_NAMES)
$ SHO TIME
9-NOV-2004 16:17:04
$

Notice that the daylight savings and timezone name did not change to 1 and EDT.

I really appreciate your input.
Layne

Re: VMS - change from EDT to EST - have question about daylight_savings.com

Volker Halle — Wed, 10 Nov 2004 03:05:33 GMT

Layne,

it looks like you need to be in the appropriate time zone interval (EDT or EST), to allow the procedure to change those 2 logicals: SYS$TIMEZONE_DAYLIGHT_SAVINGS and SYS$TIMEZONE_NAME.

You tried to change to EDT (DAYLIGHT) on 9-NOV-2004, which is clearly outside the valid DST interval as defined in the rule:

SYS$TIMEZONE_RULE" = "EST5EDT4,M4.1.0/02,M10.5.0/02
(DST = Daylight Savings Time EDT goes from 1st sunday in April until last Sunday in October).

Try to set your system time to 1-OCT-2004 and then change to EDT (DAYLIGHT). Then set the time to 1-NOV-2004 and change to EST (STANDARD).

I tried this on my E8.2 system with MET and MET DST and those 2 logicals changed as expected.

You might want to do this on a test system to not confuse anything related to timestamps !

Volker.

Re: VMS - change from EDT to EST - have question about daylight_savings.com

Volker Halle — Wed, 10 Nov 2004 08:10:12 GMT

Layne,

your DAYLIGHT_SAVINGS.COM (dated 31-MAR-2004) has come from VMS731_TDF-V0500, so this explains why it could be the same version as included in E8.2

Volker.

Re: VMS - change from EDT to EST - have question about daylight_savings.com

Layne Burleson_1 — Wed, 10 Nov 2004 08:15:40 GMT

Volker,

I think you have solved my problem.... Let me make sure I understand... The SYS$TIMEZONE_RULE determines when the logicals get set and since I am trying to run it outside of that window, it is not changing. Is it possible to modify that rule to run a test?

You have been most helpful and I really appreciate it.

Layne

Re: VMS - change from EDT to EST - have question about daylight_savings.com

Volker Halle — Wed, 10 Nov 2004 08:39:38 GMT

Layne,

yes, these are my conclusions from your (and my) experience when playing with DAYLIGHT_SAVINGS.COM - and it makes sense to me, that nobody has bothered to test switching to daylight savings time during the winter season ;-)

Changing the rule for a test (I assume you don't want to change the time too much):

I must admit, that I still have not fully understood, where the real source of the timezone rule definition is located.

If DECnet-OSI is installed and you're using DTSS, it seems to come from DTSS$TIMEZONE_RULES.DAT.

I only know that invoking @SYS$MANAGER:UTC$TIME_SETUP is the only supported and reliable way to change these settings in the running system.

Just re-defining the translation of SYS$TIMEZONE_RULE may not work, but you could try. I ran my tests on a test system after a minimum boot.

Volker.

Re: VMS - change from EDT to EST - have question about daylight_savings.com

Layne Burleson_1 — Wed, 10 Nov 2004 08:53:01 GMT

Volker,
I'll try proceeding in that direction. I still run Decnet phase IV. I've got a contact in HP support that used to be my TAM. She is working on a timezone problem and I've asked her to explain the timezone rule. I'll pass any info I receive on to you so that we can clear up this mystery.

Thanks again for helping.
Layne

Re: VMS - change from EDT to EST - have question about daylight_savings.com

Martin Vorlaender — Wed, 10 Nov 2004 09:52:15 GMT

Volker,

>>>
I must admit, that I still have not fully understood, where the real source of the timezone rule definition is located.
<<<

The FAQ has a complete chapter about VMS system time, time keeping, daylight savings, etc.

See http://h71000.www7.hp.com/wizard/faq/vmsfaq_004.html#time4 for explanations about timezones.

cu,
Martin

Re: VMS - change from EDT to EST - have question about daylight_savings.com

Robert_Boyd — Tue, 14 Dec 2004 14:59:04 GMT

I've worked with situations where we had systems running NTP, DTSS, both and neither all in the same environment. Since there were so many systems, I wrote a command procedure that works correctly up through VMS V7.3-2 in all the cases I've dealt with so far.

This assumes that you've already executed the proper timezone setup procedure as relates the the system you're on.

Here is the command procedure as an attachment.
I'd be curious to see any feedback about how it is affected by changes in V8.x

Robert Boyd