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Work related B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B# $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

Paula J Frazer-Campbell
Honored Contributor

Work related B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B# $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

Hi

We are currently re-negotiating our call out payments with the company and I was looking to get a "feel" of what is average.

I do not wish you to give figures just a % of hourly rate.

Basically normal working week = 37.5 hours (I wish) - so on call is 130.5 hours -

So what % of normal hourly rate do you or your staff get just to be available and what rates i.e. time and half, double are then paid if called.

Any info gratefully received.

Many thanks to those who respond.

Paula
If you can spell SysAdmin then you is one - anon
46 REPLIES
Alan Casey
Trusted Contributor

Re: Work related B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B# $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

Here we get:

25% of hourly rate for on call up to 8 hours/day (double time for anything over 8 hours)

If called in, doulbe time from time of contact for weekends including Sunday and Bank Holidays.

Alan
Alan Casey
Trusted Contributor

Re: Work related B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B# $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

And just to make you sick!!

Our week is 34 hours here and strictly followed by means of flexi-time!
Jeff Machols
Esteemed Contributor

Re: Work related B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B# $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

based on a X hour week, takes the number of hours working on call Y. Y/X gives the %. so if you wokr 50 hour weeks and get 5 hours a week off hours calls, 10% increase. This is based on average on call week, the on-call people get 10% increase to the base salary of that grade. (on call hours count 2-1 between 10pm and 7am).
Alan Riggs
Honored Contributor

Re: Work related B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B# $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

Work week == 40 hours (yeah, right)
On call compensation == deep feeling of satisfaction for providing value ot the company (see above)

Oh, and the pleasure of spreading joyous hilarity to management every time I raise teh issue.
Steven Gillard_2
Honored Contributor

Re: Work related B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B# $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

Thank god I'm no longer on call, life is so much better :)

But when I was I was getting about 20% of my hourly rate for being on call, and if I got called then it would be 120% for the time that I worked. Weekends and public holidays were 170% callout rate.

At the time I thought this was a pretty good deal because I knew people who got absolutely nothing for working much longer on-call hours than I did. It was 'part of their job' or so they were told, so it was apparently factored into their package.

Regards,
Steve
Paula J Frazer-Campbell
Honored Contributor

Re: Work related B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B# $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

Thanks Alan

My normal week is between 45 and 50 hours without any major probkems occuring.

Ps not many points for second answer and making me sick.

;^)

Paula
If you can spell SysAdmin then you is one - anon
Tim D Fulford
Honored Contributor

Re: Work related B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B# $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

I look at the above & feel very hard done by!

Our on call has two elements to it:
o0o we get roughly 5% for being on call on a per day basis (i.e work 8 hours normal & get paid 0.05*16 for the evening). This covers the fact you can't drink, go out, have a life...
Weekends & bank hols are double weekdays (i.e. if you got 5 peanuts for a Tuesday you get 10 peanuts for a Saturday).

o0o When it does go wrong & you are called 1hr minimum and the rate is 4/3 per hour. max claim 8 hours per day & 12 hours on a weekend (though this is negotiable). There is no differentiation between weekdays & weekends etc.

Tim
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Craig Rants
Honored Contributor

Re: Work related B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B# $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

We are on call one week out of every six, and for our time we get a cell phone (which can be used for personal calls) and comp time.

Last place I worked, a call on which you performed action was automatically one hour of your pay rate, if you had to go on site, it was two hours.

C
"In theory, there is no difference between theory and practice. But, in practice, there is. " Jan L.A. van de Snepscheut
Victor BERRIDGE
Honored Contributor

Re: Work related B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B# $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

Here we get:
Depends who is calling (police, income tax...)
from 20:00 to 24:00 => peanuts (4 ??)
00:00 to 07:00 => maybe 6 ??
week-end : peanuts *2

You have for that a cell phone you can use for you own private calls...
If you have to do an intervention then things get interresting : If is police call you get paid your hourly fee majorated by 25% from 19:00 to 20:00, 50% 20:00 to 24:00 100% 00:00 to 06:00 and sundays
The rest is:
same majoration of hours on a special hour counter you can take later, only you can normally only take half a day a month, and thats how you finish like me after almost 5 years with 10 weeks of holidays to take some time (??? When???), well over 1000 hours credit on the special counter, and young kids at home (5 and 3yrs) wondering why they can never see Dad in the evening before to go to bed and never at home on week-ends in december...

Marvelous world isnt it?

All the best

Victor
someone_4
Honored Contributor

Re: Work related B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B# $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

Ok this is intresting ..
All I can say is from my side as being on call and working. Our work week is 40 hours. Then on call .. for on call sometimes something takes 5 minutes and sometimes it takes 5 hours. Now my thing is if it takes 10 min to fix something but they call at 3 am. And then you cant go to sleep till 4am and the rest of your day you feel like crap. What do you charge for? Then I have times where I spend my free time just working. So what it comes down to is what is someones time worth. How much is a bad day worth for being woken up and not able to go to sleep. What about when you are with your woman and you have to break away cuss the phone rings. How much is all this really worth? I dont have kids but what if you have kids .. an on call phone can really shake everything up.But what is fair ?

Richard
Justo Exposito
Esteemed Contributor

Re: Work related B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B# $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

Hi Evereybody,

I'm reading the answers and I am thinking that is very hard your work conditions.

This is the new economy? I want the old.

Regards,

Justo.
Help is a Beatiful word
Paula J Frazer-Campbell
Honored Contributor

Re: Work related B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B# $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

Hi Justo.

La ayuda de Unix en un ambiente de 24/7/365 es dura, pues la compa????a espera que el negocio sea el 100% %100 disponibles del tiempo.

Los muchos de diversi??n pueden ser tenidos tan en intentar realizar cambios al sistema operativo.

Qu?? lo hacen usted hace eso es tan f??cil?

;^)
Paula


Hi Justo.

Unix support in a 24/7/365 environment is hard, as the company expects the business to be 100% available %100 of the time. So a lot of fun can be had in trying to make changes to the operating system.

What do you do that is so easy?

;^)
Paula
If you can spell SysAdmin then you is one - anon
harry d brown jr
Honored Contributor

Re: Work related B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B# $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

Are you kidding me? We get paid in pennies, and you are talking about dollars? Got any opennings?

For internal calls (our company) we do/did this:
A flat fee for being on call (on call being outside your normal working hours, which for some its outside of 8am-5pm), say $50, then a fixed rate per call at $15, unless that call goes on for more than two hours or crosses into another zone (a zone is like 8am-5pm, 5pm-9pm, 9pm-12mid, 12mid-3am, 3am-8am) then we added another $15.

If you weren't on call, but got one from anyway's - 'cause you are the expert, then you received $50.

For true client calls:
a flat rate of $150 an hour with a 3 hour minimum, so $450, with 1/2 going to person on call - providing that the call is billable back to client - ie client screwed up, hardware failed, OS failure, or third party software failed. If it was our software, then we received $50. This forced us to fix our bad application code, so that the failures were normally limited to REAL BILLABLE hours. I got $$$ signs in my eyes...

Normally we would get anywhere from a few thousand to over 6k a year.


Tell them to raise your salaries by 25%, give you laptop's, company paid cell phones (even for reasonable personal use), a network and printer at home, cable modem, network, with the company furnishing (paying for) the necessary equipment, and a room rental (for occupying the space in your flat / apartment / house / trailer / cabin / pickup truck / tent / prison cell.


live free or die ----> and take as much money from them as possible!

harry
Live Free or Die
fg_1
Trusted Contributor

Re: Work related B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B# $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

Paula

At our company, we get paid a rate which is 125% of our hourly rate for the time we are on-call with a 2hour minimum charge per call (even if the call is 5 minutes).

The caveat to this is that for the time we are on-call we actually have to go and be on-site at the client versus having the luxury of dialing in.

The good to this is that we are also charging them for travel time to and from the site, thus the 2hour minimum.

Good luck and squeeze them for all their worth.

FG.


Darrell Allen
Honored Contributor

Re: Work related B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B# $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

Hi Paula,

In my last job it was left to the manager's discretion how to handle comp time for being on call. Notice I said comp time, not call pay. All SAs were salaried and exempt (I think that just means exempt from receiving overtime pay). So when we were on call (12x7) we would get a day (or 2) for "R&R". That's mainly because we had to be working during our call shift (including the weekend). Hopefully we were able to take that time off but not always. And when we weren't on call we were still subject to being paged (with a pager we were expected to wear even though we weren't on call).

We did get 3% of our base salary tacked on because they figured out that 3% of the time (24x7x365) we were on call during evening hours and weekends and the company did pay a shift premium. That only happened after some SAs complained to HR.

In my current job I don't get paid for on call. I'm basically on call always but thankfully I don't get called often (small shop). When I do work a issue, my manager is good to work with me on my schedule though there is no official policy. That's the way it was with jobs I had earlier in my career as well.

Darrell
"What, Me Worry?" - Alfred E. Neuman (Mad Magazine)
Paula J Frazer-Campbell
Honored Contributor

Re: Work related B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B# $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

Hi
Some more info on our "on Call"

We are in a 24/7/365 business (Travel).

Our connectivity is to country wide travel agents and Airport desks.

So when on call we are on call 25/7 - one week at a time.

It is not uncommon to get a call at 02:00 from an airport desk.

Also during weekend travel agents work Sat and Sun (shopping malls) so call at weekend are also not uncommon.

Company requirements :-

1. Sober
2. With 90 min to site.
3. Mobile phone on 24/7 and with signal.
4. Carry laptop at all times.

As one person does not hold all skill sets it is expected that persons not on call will assist 24/7 if called.

So what is being this available worth?

What is getting up at 02:00 to fix a problem worth

Paula
If you can spell SysAdmin then you is one - anon
Mark Greene_1
Honored Contributor

Re: Work related B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B# $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

Our work week is 40 hours. If you work over 40, but not on-call, that is tracked seperately (but not paid). The total number of "over 40" hours is then a factor into your annual bonus, if you get one. I've only been in this job a bit over 6 months, so I've yet to experience the later bit directly.

The on-call rotation we have right now is once every 4 weeks; pay is $2/hr for 16 hours during the week (cause you're getting paid for the 8 you are in the office) and 24 hours each Sat and Sun. If you get called and can deal with it over the phone or by dialing in, there's no extra. If you have to come in, then you get paid straight-time for that, minimum 2 hours, door-to-door.

The downside is there is no official compensation time. I have a flexable start time, but if I get called and am up 3 hours the night before, I am still expected to put in my 8 the next day and the 40 for the week.

HTH
mark
the future will be a lot like now, only later
John Payne_2
Honored Contributor

Re: Work related B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B# $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

Try this on for size...

40-55 hour work week.

I am only 'on-call' 1 week in 3 months. If anyone gets an HPUX call any other time when I am not 'on-call', then I get a call. When the operators get lonely at night, I get a call.

I get reimbursed if I have to drive in to work on a callout. I live 3 blocks from work, so I never posted the milage for the $2.50. I am an 'administrative' employee, so I get the same pay if I work 10 or 196 hours a week.

Here are the benefits: cable modem at home, desktop machine at home, laptop, wireless at work (good for boring meetings), cell, no pager (Thank Goodness!), palm pilot, and I can usually count on a meal or two on a bad callout and maybe a day off... (At least long enough to get a good 8 hours sleep.)

Oh yeah, and we are a University, so if something breaks, people are not breathing down my neck about the money were are losing... They just breath down my neck about the students that can not access a service.

All in all, I think I have an ok deal. (At least from what some of the posts say...)
Spoon!!!!
Alan Riggs
Honored Contributor

Re: Work related B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B# $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

Oh--and as long as I am pulling out the violin:

I have been on-call (with the exception of days that I spend vacation) every day for nearly 18 months.

I do get the occassional comp day from management, and nobody *ever* complains about what time I clock in in the morning.
Paula J Frazer-Campbell
Honored Contributor

Re: Work related B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B# $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

Hi Alan

Sury there must be some sort of package for this sort of availability, or is it factored in on salary.


Paula
If you can spell SysAdmin then you is one - anon
Scott Van Kalken
Esteemed Contributor

Re: Work related B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B# $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

I'm much like Alan.

I don't get paid oncall, I can't take time in lieu.

I've been here for nearly 12 months.

The only exception is that working for a bunch of accountants, people DO complain if I turn up late.

Scott.
Alan Riggs
Honored Contributor

Re: Work related B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B# $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

Paula -- it's a relatively small environment (24 severs, 1 SAN) which I have gotten tuned to the point that it is pretty reliable. I rarely get calls which requier more than a few minutes to fix. There used to be 2 of us to split duties, but he left and hiring freezes hit before we got a replacement. So-- payback ins that I build things the way that I want them to be and (must be a coincidence, eh?) they don't break very often. My last shop (multi-billion dollar telco) did compensate for oncall availability and for hours worked above 50, but I averaged more than 70 hours/wk (record 116) and the extra money was *not* worth the personal cost.

The salary here is reasonably good, but no specific compensation for being "always available". I do get the toys (laptop, DSL, cell phone) to make the job easier.
Paula J Frazer-Campbell
Honored Contributor

Re: Work related B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B# $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

Hi Alan

There is a lot to be said for being the only one -

Isn't that a line from a film -

" There can be only one"

"My name is Conner McCloud of the clan McCloud and I was born on the shores of Glenfinnen in the year of our lord 1524 and I cannot die"

Back to the point:- one sysadmin and no one to mess it up - if only we could get rid of users.


Paula

BTW time here in UK 21:00 hrs and I'm still at work.


If you can spell SysAdmin then you is one - anon
John Bolene
Honored Contributor

Re: Work related B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B#B# $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

I am on salary, normally work 40-45 hour weeks.

This means I get to have a stable income.

Stable income = no money if I get called.

I am always on call, pager on all the time.

Good thing is, it mostly all works and I get probably 2 or 3 calls per month.
It is always a good day when you are launching rockets! http://tripolioklahoma.org, Mostly Missiles http://mostlymissiles.com