WEBES - where can I find it?

[Paul Jerrom]

Hi all,

I'm wanting to find WEBES for VMS, but can't find it to download it.
It's not on HP's WEBES page (http://h18000.www1.hp.com/support/svctools/webes/index.html) - all I can find is WEBES for Windows, or something called ELMC test scripts for VMS, but not WEBES for VMS.
Any ideas, anyone?

Have fun,

PJ

[Volker Halle]

Paul,

interesting, the OpenVMS WEBES versions had been there before...

Ask HP !

Volker.

[Volker Halle]

Paul,

looks like HP has completely dropped support of OpenVMS as of WEBES V5.6. The installation guide only mentions Windows.

Volker.

[Ian Miller.]

elmc is available for OpenVMS so it appears you collect the data on OpenVMS and analyse it on windows. Not a surprise I suppose.

[Ian Miller.]

Does this mean there is no way to analyse the error log on OpenVMS on current systems?

ELV is too basic. What's the alternative?

[Volker Halle]

Ian,

YES, that's what i means !

You can forget about ELV.

DECevent is only good on VAX and Alpha.

But for more recent systems and especially for I64, you NEED to run SEA (System Event Analyzer, component of WEBES).

This means that you now have to use a Windows system to look at your OpenVMS I64 errlog files !

Volker.

[cnb]

Hi Paul,

You can still find some older WEBES for VMS versions here:

ftp://ftp.hp.com/pub/svctools/

Rgds,

[Gareth Williams_2 · Accepted solution]

And what is one supposed to do if one does
not have any PCs in their environment?

This is very worrying, as I have a serious
cluster connectivity problem that is probably
hardware related which needs diagnosing. We
have a ten-node Alpha cluster in which one
or two machines will reboot themselves every
week or two. ELV doesn't translate the
error log entries, so I was planning to
install WEBES. But if there's no VMS
version, then I'm up a certain creek
without a certain instrument.

Seriously, how hard would it be to update
ELV?

Gareth Williams

[Volker Halle]

Gareth,

I would not expect HP to invest in updating ELV to allow it to correctly translate all possible errors.

WEBES was multi-platform and available for multiple operating systems, so the work to decode all possible HW errlog entries could be invested into ONE tool. I don't believe that WEBES was the 'favorite' tool of any OpenVMS system manager, but it at least allowed you to diagnose errors on the same system as they occured on. This 'feature' seems to be gone now !

Volker.

[Robert Brooks_1]

I would not expect HP to invest in updating ELV to allow it to correctly translate all possible errors.

---

Ah, yes. ELV. A nice idea that barely scratched the surface. ELV was designed by an engineer in the "platform support" or "systems group". That group was responsible for the platform-specific code (stuff like sys$loadable_images:sys$cpu_routines_*.exe, among others). As such, ELV is used primarily to decode low-level systems hardware issues, but really isn't useful for general-purpose errors.

I tried *really hard* to have the designing engineer put some stuff in there for SCSI-related problems, but it wasn't a priority for him, and I never had the time myself to figure out what needed to be done.

Sigh!

-- Rob

[Rafiq Ahamed K]

The WEBES CMS runs on Windows box and you can collect the logs remotely through installing the ELMC agent on OpenVMS nodes. So you donâ t always have to import the ERRORLOG.SYS to WEBES CMS and analyze it, instead we can remotely monitor too by adding the IA64/Alpha managed entities on WEBES CMS Webpage.

The latest release of ELMC client for OpenVMS is 2.5 which supports WEBES 5.6!

http://h18023.www1.hp.com/support/svctools/webes/webesdownloads.html#WEBES5_6

-Rafiq

[Hoff]

It'd be interesting to see WEBES as an iPad application; that'd be an approach for getting around this whole matter of reading the logs.

While iPad WEBES or Windows WEBES or such might be built to acquire its data over a serial line or USB line or sucked off the MP error buffers via some cousin of ELMC, the downside of the iPad app or the Windows WEBES is the same; getting the error log data over to the viewer when parts of the box aren't particularly running.

I'd hope the usual test case for an error log viewer tool is a box that really needs to use the error log viewer; an iffy or semi-functional server. That's when the tools most commonly get used, after all. When the box isn't working entirely right.

[Cass Witkowski]

HP plan is to only have agents on OpenVMS, HP-UX and linux and have WEBES run on Windows.

I find this unacceptable. Fo me this means I have to support another platform at lots of sites and constantly apply security patches.

If you do not like this decision then you need to voice your opinion loud and clear to HP.

[Paul Jerrom]

Well well. In 25+ years of using VMS I've seen some crassly stupid decisions, and this one ranks right up there with them.
So what do I do if the NIC might be the cause of the problem? What if the server isn't up far enough for TCPIP to be running? What do I do if I am sitting at the console?
I have several customers I access remotely whee running software on a PC just isn't possible.
Honestly, I wonder sometimes if there is a high level HP committee that sits around coming up with ways to make VMS use untenable.
No point asking HP or complaining to them, noone in NZ has given a monkey's for about a decade.

[Cass Witkowski]

It's not just OpenVMS but HP-UX as well. Please if you have an HP contract contact HP and voice your opinion

[Paul Jerrom]

There's no point in complaining to a company that has replaced customer service with a shrug.
BTW, I don't remember receiving any notification that WEBES for VMS was being pulled.
Ho hum.

[cnb]

Paul,

These are ALL VALID POINTS!

Good Question...

WAS there EVER an announcement?

I too would like to know (and we have a contract).

SneakerNet the file to Windows?

Really???


Rgds,

-cnb

[SanjayMundhra]

Webes is now available with IRS, The current version is v6.3. Youneed todownload the ELMC (wccproxy client)from the IRS server for the VMS clients.

[Hoff]

SanjayMundhra, do you have a download URL for the WEBES CMS for VMS?  (That request was my understanding of the folks that were posting in this thread; that the WEBES error displays for VMS are no more.)

For those folks following along at home, here are translatiions of some of the acronyms involved here:

WEBES:  Web Based Enterprise Services

IRS: Insight Remote Support

ELMC: Event Log Monitor Collector

WCCproxy: WEBES Common Components (WCC) Proxy

HP Insight RS: Remote Support

HP Insight RSS: Remote Support Standard

HP Insight RSA: Remote Support Advanced

Gen8: Generation Eight; a collective marketing term for a "famility" of ProLiant-branded x86 servers?

CMS: Central Management Server (part of IRS)

VMS: Virtual Memory System; also OpenVMS

MCS:  Mission Critical Services 

Here is the Insight Remote Support web page

On that page, I find "Select from HP Insight Remote Support 7.0 (for HP ProLiant Gen8 Servers only), HP Insight Remote Support Standard (for environments with 1-50 devices and a limited IT staff) or HP Insight Remote Support Advanced (for environments with up to 3,250 devices or with an HP Mission Critical Services contract)."

There is no indication of a 6.3 version listed there, though.  (And all of the HP "Gen8" stuff I've seen listed was ProLiant x86-64 gear, and not the servers that the VMS folks are typically operating with.)

For platforms, I see the following in the IRS-related QuickSpecs specifications:

---- begin quote ----

HP Insight Remote Support Standard
NOTE: Included at no additional cost with every HP ProLiant Generation 7 (G7) X86 Industry Standard Servers and their follow-on's. Additionally supports HP ProLiant Servers, HP Integrity Servers, HP 9000 Servers, HP Enterprise Virtual Arrays, HP Modular Smart Arrays, A valid warranty, HP Care Pack Service, and contractual support agreement is required. For more details, please see the HP Insight Remote Support Advanced Release Notes.

HP Insight Remote Support Advanced
NOTE: Included at no additional cost with every HP ProLiant Generation 7 (G7) X86 Industry Standard Servers. Additionally supports HP ProLiant Servers, HP Integrity Servers, HP 9000 Servers, HP Alpha servers. A valid warranty, HP Care Pack Service, and contractual support agreement is required.

---- end quote ----

With all that written, I don't see a download for VMS for anything other than what's variously called an "agent", however.  An agent appears to be a probe or monitor or shim; something that is installed onto (in this case) VMS and that then collects up the error data, and forwards it to a remote system running the Insight Management CMS error-aggregating software.  There does not seem to be a local display available; all the stuff has to be routed over to a Microsoft Windows box with the CMS running.

And if this error-reporting support could be made simpler (to find, install, configure, manage, etc), we'd all greatly appreciate the effort.  Thanks!