HP UX 10.20 or 10.30 virtualization

[ml_6]

All,

In my company we still have old servers running HPUX 10.2 10.3
Are there any ways to virtualize such servers on itanium servers or another server ?

Thanks for any help

ML

[Patrick Wallek]

I seriously doubt it.

Those OS versions went out of support before most virtualization had come about.

[ml_6]

It's the same situation as with Windows NT4. But Vmware allow to run such an unsupported OS version on a new hardware.

We use theses old HPUX versions because the applications are ok on it, and it's expensive to adapt and validate them on a new OS version.

ML

[George_Dodds]

No, you may want to look at porting your applications to a newer release.

I think the N4000 could run vpars with 11i, that might be easier to port to that itanium.

But if you are looking at getting more recent kit and current OS then your apps will need redone for ia64.

[smatador]

Hi,

I think it's possible but with condition.
See the ARIES doc
http://docs.hp.com/en/B3921-90010/Aries.5.html
No support for old gdb versions (of HP-UX 10.20 and earlier). However, debugging HP-UX 10.20 applications using a HP-UX 11.0 PA gdb is supported.
So HPVM accept aries. So you could do or "try" the virtualization.

[smatador · Accepted solution]

Hi,
Look at this "marketing" doc I think.
HP say ARIES runs the HP 9000 HP-UX 10.20 (and higher) applications transparently on HP-UX 11i v2 (and higher) on HP Integrity servers.

http://h20338.www2.hp.com/hpux11i/downloads/aries%20trans.pdf

[George_Dodds]

Thats a good link smatador you deserve full points for that, hint hint ML ;-)

It would be interesting to hear if anyone has used this.

It's something to my book of spells :-)

[George_Dodds]

Last line should of been, it's something to add to my book of spells, wish we could edit our replies.

I wonder what the overhead was like in using the the Aries emulator.

[Laurent Menase]

If your application was not compile on 9.x
it should work.
Also if it doesn't use any private APIs.

[Steven E. Protter]

Shalom,

10.20 and 10.x was PA-RISC only.

The OS was decommissioned years before virtualization became the rage.

I'd bet the farm against being able to do that.

There is a reason why HP pulls support on old OS versions.

SEP

[Torsten.]

Virtualization on Itanium hardware simulates Itanium hardware.

On "classic" Intel hardware this might be easier to emulate older Intel hardware.

But the capability of Itaniums to "emulate" RISC hardware is somehow limited.

All hp-ux versions from the beginning up to 11.11 is PA-RISC only. Applications may run on Itaniums, but not the core OS.

All 10.x versions are gone around y2k. All hardware after this date cannot run 10.x.

You can only try to run your applications with ARIES or continue to use old hardware.

BTW, 10.30 was something special anyway.

[Wim Rombauts]

If you want to go forward, you will have to validate the application on HP-UX 11i (preferable v3) PA-RISC anyway. You need to be sure that it still runs on a native PA-RISC platform with a newer OS.
It should, because HP guarantees binary compatibility.

When you are sure it runs HP-UX 11i v3 PA_RISC, you can start running it on Itanium with ARIES. If you ten get issues, you know it is an ARIES issue, or a missing PA-RISC library, not an OS version incompatibility. I tried such a setup myself and it goes fine and automatically. Just strat the executable, the OS detects it is PA-RISC code and launches ARIES. (By the way, the base java executable on Itanium is also still PA-RISC code, but only few people have noticed it). You only have to take care that if your application uses other PA-RISC applications (like an Oracle client for instance), you will need to have the Oracle PA-RISC client available on your Itanium machine also.

[Dennis Handly]

>Wim: the base java executable on Integrity is also still PA-RISC code,

This driver quickly gets out of the way when it execs the real one.

[Laurent Menase]

about Oracle, if you uses proC or things like that, it is not that easy to make it work under aries because you need to make a pa risk build env on your itanium system.
also if you uses old libs which where obsoleting in 10.20, the result may be that it could not run under ARIES.

[Wim Rombauts]

Laurent, that is exactly the reason why it is necessary to confirm that the software runs on HP-UX 11i v3 PA-RISC. If it doesn't run there, you don't even have to dream about running it under Itanium/ARIES.

So, in fact, looking at the original question : No need to talk about Itanium. It's overkill.

Your current hardware is very likely not supported under HP-UX 11i v3, so you need new (PA-RISC) hardware anyway if you want to look into an upgrade path.
Although HP has stopped selling new PA-RISC machines, there are plenty remarketed systems, with a TCO that could be a lot ower than what you pay (if you pay) for support on your current machine.
And if you get it running on HP-IX 11i v3 PA-RISC, then why spend more mony to attempt to get it on Itanium ?

[Dennis Handly]

>Wim: confirm that the software runs on HP-UX 11i v3 PA-RISC.

I don't think you need to go all the way to 11.31, 11.23 should be fine and possibly 11.11?

>And if you get it running on HP-UX 11i v3 PA-RISC, then why spend more money to attempt to get it on Integrity?

Because Integrity is likely faster and you can do virtualization as in ml's original question.

[Wim Rombauts]

Dennis,

Why choose HP-UX 11.31 ? Because 11.23 is already nearing end-of-life, so if you want to be safe for a while and use the latest technologie : go for HP-UW 11.31
Certainly not 11.11, because there is no Itanium equivalent for it.

And yes, and Itanium system will be faster, but so what ? It will cost you an extra server, while your latest PA-RISC system is already 10 times as fast as that old server back in the days of 10.20

[ml_6]

Thank you guys.
So ARIES is a way to support our old applications.
Can use it in VSE itanium environment ?

As far as I understood, I should test the app on a recent RISC HP-UX version before trying to use Aries isn't it ?
Which one ? On which server ?

Thanks

[Wim Rombauts]

What server(s) do you currently have : Type and number of CPUs and amount of memory ?

As for the HP-UX version to use, I would go to the latest, since it may spare you another upgrade within a couple of years, and it has the most and best virtualization features once you switch to Itanium.

[Dennis Handly]

>Wim: Why choose HP-UX 11.31? ... use the latest technology: go for HP-UX 11.31

You were suggesting to go to 11.31 to go to Integrity.

>Itanium system will be faster, but so what?

Now you seem to be saying don't go to Integrity. My point was to get them to Integrity ASAP.

[smatador]

Hi Ml,

If you ask for VSE itanium environment, maybe that mean you have yet an itanium box.

The test on a PA, is to be more sure that on integrity aries do the job.

Aries can take a lot of memory, but if you play with some parameter on .ariesrc file you could obtain some "good" results even if for sure there will never be like a dedicated application for IA.