Reasons to upgrade to 11i

[Dave Johnson_1]

I need to write up a document that includes a list of reasons to upgrade from 11.00 to 11i. Continued support is not reason enough. I need to list all the benefits of doing this. Any suggestions would really help me out.
Thankx,
-Dave

[James R. Ferguson]

Hi Dave:

Well, if "unsupported" (as of 12/31/2006) isn't good enough, then build your case from the richer features of 11.11 or 11.23 if you hardware supports it. See, in particular:

http://docs.hp.com/en/5990-7288/ch03s02.html?btnNext=next%A0%BB

http://docs.hp.com/en/5991-5320/ch03s01.html?btnNext=next%A0%BB

http://www.hp.com/softwarereleases/releases-media2/history/slide2.html

Regards!

...JRF...

[Steven E. Protter]

Shalom Dave,

1) Support for 11.00 ends December 31, 2006. That means if you need help and aren't the US government, you can't get it from HP. I've got a quite a bit of sysadmin experience and support 10.20 systems and 11.00 systems that the user/application situation will not permit upgrade. Difficult problems come up that require a support call. The value of being able to do that is hard to calculate.

2) 11i v1 is faster and more efficent, and there are more third party applications for it thatn 11.00

3) Oracle and many application vendors will begin dropping support for 11.00 at the time HP does or in the years after. This multiplies the support problems.

SEP

[Dave Johnson_1]

James,
The last link you provided indicates sales of 11i v1 and 11i v2 will end 12/31/2008 with support until 12/31/2013. It does not indicate any additional "new" releases pending. Does this mean HP is dropping HP-UX as a product at the end of 2008? Or am reading too much between the lines and the next release is just not announced yet?

[Patrick Wallek]

HP is not dropping HP-UX. There is currently an 11iV3 (or some similar name) in the works for release later this year or early next year.

Another thing to consider -- patches (security and bug fixes). When 11.0 goes off of support, there will be very very few new patches available to fix problems.

[Dave Johnson_1]

Thank you all for the info.
I am on board with the hole keep it supported and patchable. The people above me need the new features list. What "new" stuff do we get for this big effort. I have already been told if my only benefit is continued support, I will not be allowed to do the upgrade. I am currently reading the info link from James "What is HP-UX 11i Version 1?". I think this will provide what they want.
I am only assigning 7 points so as to not set this as "Magically resolved" yet.

[James R. Ferguson]

Hi (again) Dave:

...and if you don't believe my friend, Patrick, note that you can already see a "slot" for 11.31 patches when selecting the OS version on the "Search for Patches" screen for HP-UX in the Patch Database. That version has been the number commonly associated with what we think will be branded "11i v3".

:-))

Regards!

...JRF...

[Torsten.]

IMHO the "out-of-support date" *should* be a good reason.

BTW, there is already a section for HP-UX 11.31 (11i v3) patches on www.itrc.com patch database - still empty, of course.

[Patrick Wallek]

My argument with your manaements mentality is:

If I can't call for support when the thing breaks, then don't blame me if something happens and we can't recover from it.

[Dave Johnson_1]

At another employer (and more than a few years ago) I had a signed document (a get out of jail free card if you will) saying I was not at fault if it breaks and we do not have support. I was still yelled at because I did not make a strong enough case for the upgrade in the first place. I want to make sure the higher ups "buy in to" this upgrade. Any info will help the cause. None of them understand the first thing about servers let alone the PC on their desk, so this is a strugle all the way.

[A. Clay Stephenson]

The 11.0 to 11.11 transition is straightforward and I've seen almost no code that will function under 11.0 that will not function under 11.11 (except kernel intrusive code such as lsof). This is really not a huge effort and will buy you a huge chunk of support time. I would feel a bit less confident going to 11.23 but 11.11 is a very easy transition especially if you kept vg00 clean and related to the OS only. Even a cold install should require only 3-4 hours per box to get it fully patched to equivalent levels.

This is a time when a Sandbox can really help you because you can develop a fully tested migration plan. If those above you don't trust you to make this evaluation then
what criteria are they applying?

[Dave Johnson_1]

Thank you all for the info.
Clay,
I have done this once already. It did only take about 4 hours but then there were some additional patches to apply to bring that server to the same patch level as an rp4440 we purchased last summer. We try very hard to have all the servers at the exact same patch set. So it is a little less than a day not counting the backup before hand. The total project needs to include all the time to relink Oracle Database, Oracle Applications, and Oracle Portal (Apache). Then we have test almost everything. A few clicks through the application and that is done, but all the interfaces to other vendors would need to be tested. That is where the justification comes in. I need to justify the some 100 man hours it will take to get all the servers (it is only 4 of 6 that need to be upgraded) upgraded and tested (including the time I am spending with you researching and writing documentation, my fingers are getting sore already).

[A. Clay Stephenson]

The other vendors' software should be straightforward. Just ask each vendor for a letter of indicating supported OS versions and make sure they are aware of the EOS date for 11.0. Those vendors should have already done this testing.

[Torsten.]

I'm not the oracle expert at all, but I can imagine they will stop the support for the old versions applying to 11.00 sometimes too.

If you have a problem somewhere between oracle and OS someday, you will be on your own, because you will hear "unsupported" from every direction.

How about your hardware? Could be a problem too. Please compare:

http://www.hp.com/products1/unix/operating/public_hp-ux_systems_support.pdf

[TwoProc]

Re: moving the Oracle system from 11.0 to 11i. I did this years back with absolutely NO problems at all. They were so compatible that for a while, we would clone 11i system to 11.0 servers that hadn't been upgraded yet, with no problems.

I've no list of features to show you, but I can tell you of the thing that I found nicest for a sysadmin that I liked.

When a failed disk goes down and is replaced, the system would have to be told to vgcfgrestore, then vgsync. You won't have to anymore, when you stick in a new disk, (depending on the hardware attached), lvm mirroring will probably just notice the disk and start resync'ing the mirrors for you.

Of course, you'd have to double check what's going on for bootable disks, but everything else works quite automatically.

[Bill Hassell]

Another point which is usually a showstopper: Does your company fall under US government regulations for Sarbanes-Oxley or HIPAA? If so, a future audit of your 11.0 systems may fail and there is no fix because the patch will never be created. Even without SOX or HIPAA regulations, lack of ongoing security patches will eventually put your system(s) at risk. Of course, you can remove the LAN cables and be fairly secure.

If management does not understand Unix'y things, perhaps the demise of support for Win95 and now Win98 and WinME will help. Those systems will be bright targets for hackers. One absolute certainty with networking: the threats will always change even if the systems do not.