Thread Disappeared?

[John Collier]

Jeff,

If you read back up this thread, I expected no less than to have my one entry deleted long ago.

The fact that the entry it's self and the overall thread is still here is almost encouraging.

I wonder if maybe Dan may not have pointed the new management back to the uproars that happened when this same kind of thing was attempted in the past.

Perhaps it was noted that some of the really heavy-hitters backed off of the forums for a while when it was determined that the valuable time they invest in replying to a thread might be deleted.

Let's face it, nobody wants to throw their time away for nothing.

The life or death of this thread will be an interesting test of the new management's intentions.

John

[Michael Steele_2]

"...Meet the new boss same as the old boss..."

Not exactly true is it? Pink Floyd wrote that by the way.

I recall the thread in question since I responded to it. I hear Jeff S. and others and agree that a new style of management has been introduced. One of these new introductions has to do with the sending of private emails to forum members. I received one about a ServiceGuard thread containing an attachment from a ServiceGuard class. For purposes of citing my references to a zealous forum member I scanned in chapter 6 and attached it to my response. Later, a private email from HP Education reminded me that the attachment was copyrighted. No biggie. But I don't think previous management would have said anything. And I wonder if others have received private emails for similar infractions.

My biggest concern with new management however is with the damages caused through new technical changes in the forum. These new technical changes affect how we respond to a problem and some are not all that successful. I believe important threads are being lost. I know I can't pull up my old responses from last month or before. And what I get is ordered in such a way that my congratulatory threads are always at the top. This poor retrieval and poor ordering causes me to rewrite and redo work that I've already performed. It wastes my time because I can no longer get the information I need electronically, and instead have to refer to my books for the answer. Hence, the root cause for my private ServiceGuard email.

I can always go elsewhere to find humor but I can only come here for my work related problems.

Fin.

[Pete Randall]

Michael,

Beg to differ! The phrase "Meet the new boss/same as the old boss" was written by Pete Townshend of The Who and appeared on the 1971 album "Who's Next". If I recall correctly, the words were kind of a trailer to the song "Won't Get Fooled Again".


Pete

P.S. This will probably push this thread so far into off-topic land that it *will* finally get yanked. If so, I apologize.

[Pete Randall]

http://www.thewho.net/discography/songs/WontGetFooledAgain.html

[James Specht]

I read through this thread and was very surprised not to see someone from HP chime in their $.02. It was very interesting to read everyone's backgrounds and I too was searching for it for some time the next morning before I gave up.

My $.02 on their email notice is that is could be worded a bit nicer. It does come across like you are at fault of doing wrong. I received one and thought I had crossed the line until I remembered what thread it was. I had done some testing when the double crlf did not work. I felt the email was out of place in that case.

--Jim

[Michael Steele_2]

Thanks Pete!

[Pete Randall]

Just showing my age, Michael!

[doug mielke]

Pete,

Who did that song?
Yes, Who did that song.
Yes did that song?
No, Who did that song.
Do I have to Guess Who did that song?
No, Guess Who did NOT do that song. Who did that song.
Yo' know who did that song?
And on and Ono....
(oh, stop it U2)

[Geoff Wild]

Maybe the solution is to have a "Non Technical" forum.

Either that, or maybe Merijn can install Mambo Server(or php forum) on the HP-UX software for ITRC members ( http://www.cmve.net/~merijn/ ) and we can all go there for non - technical posts.


Rgds...Geoff

[Todd McDaniel_1]

yes agree we need a non-technical page that no points are assigned to or by posters.

Purely for discussion purposes... whether it be professional or personal topics...

[Vijaya Kumar_3]

I just now saw Merijn's Site and it is really GREAT.... it will a great idean to have an off topic forum there... why not?

-Vijay

[Steven E. Protter]

I liked your thread and when I posted to it I found nothing wrong with it.

I find nothing wrong with this thread either.

Why zap your thread and leave my itrc hobby thread with everyones kid pictures in it lying around?

The policy is seems consistent, but is incnsistently enforced.

Frankly, I don't like that one bit. HP owns this space and I acknowledge it. They need to be a bit more responsible and transparent in how they run it.

Zero points please, I want to go over Olympus status with a rabbit solution. That is also why I've been skipping congrats threads this week.

SEP

[Jeff Schussele]

ping

DAN - Does anyone at HP care to respond or should we just conceed that they intend to ignore this issue?

Rgds,
Jeff

[Mehdi_1]

Hi

I am not much bother, why my thread was disappeared. What bothers me most, I don't know why it was disappeared. It would be nice someone from HP explains the procedure for us.

Mehdi

[Ralph Grothe]

Hello Guys,

I've been trying to login to ITRC all day but wasn't serviced any page at all.
Already thought they had banned me from ITRC.

I'm amazed how much dust this raised which wasn't my intention.
This was only meant as an exclamation of my astonishment rather than a "J'accuse!".

But this is getting very interesting, and I also now wonder when at last they will either dump this thread, or one of the forums' moderators will cast in a statement.

The responses are especially illustrative and instructive for a non Anglo/American to learn about mentalities and views.
So a forum like this not only gives me the unique opportunity to gain technical HP-UX related knowledge from the experts, but additionally has the agreeable side effect of giving me the chance to practice and improve my English (see my pronunciation thread as an example) and show how different folks tick (e.g. guardians of free speach etc.).
I know there are hundreds of forums, chats, mailing lists in the internet that cover these needs, but why not allowing for a little digression once in a while even in this forum?

Therefore, I liked the proposal of Geoff to set up another website of ITRC forum members for such off topics and the humorous twist.
It was a good idea to possibly let this be arranged by "His Perl Highness Procura"
(huh, have you noticed the product affiliation? HPHP = HP**2), provided he would be willing.
Perl seems the right tool for this.
Maybe as an Apache mod_perl mySQL or PostgreSQL combo, or a twiki, or a Slashdot site?

[Kimberly Ann · Accepted solution]

Hi All,

Sorry I've been so tardy to reply. Many of you I see posting here are folks I've met in person or have communicated with in the forums or 'offline'. Obviously, the recent deletion of an off-topic thread was in no way meant as a large HP thumb held over the heads of the community.

We've had this discussion a few times in the past about off-topic threads with many of you weighing in. We agreed that this was not the place for off-topic posts or 'chat', we wanted to maintain the technical nature of this community, and in the end I certainly appreciated the support. At times this message is not heard by newbies or those that aren't 'aware'.

When threads are removed, a set of message guidelines are applied by the moderators. Please understand these folks are perusing the site to help keep it clean, civil, and sane while also helping out with questions. The intent is genuinely in support of the community, not against it. The goal is a better experience for everyone. The guidelines used are listed at http://forums1.itrc.hp.com/service/forums/helptips.do?#24 Luckily in the HP-UX space, it is rare that any of the guidelines are crossed over.

I understand there can be subjectivity to whether a post is either off-topic or related to IT but not technical. In the case of Ralphs's thread, I can see where the IT connection is made and it could have gone either way.

I've heard a couple lobby for an 'off-topic' area. If we were to create one, can we agree to keep it connected to the IT profession and this community (jobs, salary expectations, entreprenurial ventures, hobbies, etc.). Examples of not being connected are NHL hockey playoff results, aircraft carriers for sale, and halloween party photos.

Please let me know.

And Ralph, sorry your thread was removed.

Thanks,
Dan

[Kimberly Ann]

Wanted to comment back to Jeff, Steven, John, Michael, etc.....

Michael, the ordered list issue is being fixed now. If you click 'more...' at the end of any list in your profile you can find your entire list of questions, solutions, and replies ordered by most recent.

Ralph/Procura, lets look at creating an off-topic area here -- easy enough.

Jeff, the response you'll get from HP is from me...and again, sorry for being late to the party.

Steven, the moderation guidelines haven't changed in 3 years. The execution of those guidelines may have -- and I'll promise to address this with the team.

John C...agreed...and yes, this thread will stay. It has been good to read what is on your minds. Good list by the way....and some of you have my email...use it anytime.

Todd, my apologies for your messages being removed. Feel free to post again...they won't disappear this time.

Doug, this community is yours. The purpose is to provide you a peer-peer area for discussions in support of your IT environments. HP responds, but does not guarantee a response. Threads of this nature don't occur often.

John P...good idea about a 'warning' post.

Pete -- hey, there it is! I've always like the creativity in Harry's title, and I appreciated his and everyone's understanding.

Procura, agree with your reasoning.

Mehdi, due to the volume of messages posted monthly across all discussion areas, the moderators use their best judgement based on the guidelines mentioned in my previous post. Message removal is not common and the intent is to mantain the clarify of these forums and reduce the noise (as some have mentioned). Mehdi, I apologize that you are not better communicted to about your post removal.

All....again, I appreciate your understanding and support. I'll promise to make it a priority to address this with the moderators. Please feedback your thoughts on an 'off-topic' area and guidelines around what is acceptable to post there.

Thanks,
Dan

[V. Nyga]

Hi all,

well it seems like nobody wants to answer after Dan's reply.
Hey Ralph, I think his reply is worth 10 pts.

Dan, I think for an 'off-topic' area we should use the same guidelines except no.1:

1. Off-topic comments not related to a technical issue regarding an HP product or related business support issue.

Well no commercials.

I've no more ideas what could be bad, I hope a HP moderator will monitor this area, too, and will tell us what HP don't want to read.

Maybe we get an inspiration from Mount Olympus ;-))

Volkmar
*with 2 deleted threads*