DL380 G8 fans.

[fishy007]

Does this seem like something that might be fixable via firmware? Or does the P420 have to run that hot all the time?

I've confirmed what Kusado already said. The server is near silent without the bloody P420. I removed it and it's running like my other HP servers.

My choices right now are to wait and hope for a fix from HP (if it's fixable) or get another SAS controller. Problem is that another controller might have the exact same problem. No way to know without testing.

[Oscar A. Perez]

The P420 card runs hot and requires plenty of airflow to keep it at or below the targeted temperature of 85ºC.  The problem here is the massive backplane inside these Storage models that supports either 12 LFF or 25 SFF hard drives. The backplane limits the airflow to the back of the server and this cannot be fixed with firmware.  

Here is what I tried this morning before I posted the reply. With my P420 nice and cool at around 72ºC,  I used my iLO debug to manually lower the minimum fan speed for Slot 2 from the default 90 PWM to 50 PWM.  The fans immediately slowed down to 19% but, a minute later the fans were back at mid 30s because, the P420 rapidly heated up to 85ºC.  This tells me that in this system, the fans need to run above 30% all the time to be able to cool the P420 card.

I'm trying to get ahold of a Riser with SAS to test if it makes a difference.  So far, I've only managed to keep the P420 running cooler on PCIe slots that are x4, like slot 4.  But, running this card on a PCIe x4 slot is going to impact the storage performance.

[fishy007]

Hmm.  Ok. New question/tactic:   Do you know if it's possible/easy to change the backplane?

I bought this system with the intent of turning it into a SAN down the road, but it's not necessary.  If I can get a backplane that has adequate airflow, I can reduce the noise.  All I'd personally need is somethign that can house up to 8 2.5" SAS drives. 

Unfortunately I have limited experience with Proliant servers and no experience with replacing/purchasing a backplane. 

The noise is really driving me insane.....

[Oscar A. Perez]

The whole hard drive cage has to be replaced. It is not hard to do (8 screws plus disconnecting all the cables) but, the hood is different so, is the length of the SAS cables.

In my case, I could do it quickly because, I got few units in my lab that I could play with. Finding all the parts you need and doing the conversion yourself could be a Royal PITA.  I think it would be better for you just to call HP and try to get unit exchanged for a different DL380e configuration, the one that has the 8x SFF drives option.

[fishy007]

Well I called HP and I'm actually still on the phone with them right now. It's been about 2 hours and the problem is still not resolved.

The tech I spoke with conferred with Level-2-Support several times during the course of the call, but said that he could not authorize a different backplane or controller card. If I wanted either one, I'd need to get authorization from my point of sale.   I'm not sure how he expects my reseller to do that, but I digress.

Eventually the tech decided to send out a replacement backplane and SAS Contoller card. The exact same models as I already have (P420 w/2GB and 25 SFF).  I doubt that this will do anything, but the tech said that if it doesn't work, they'll escalate it to Level-3-support.

While I appreciate that the tech is doing what he can, I'm not really impressed with HP overall. We've had no problems with their servers until this machine.  I've been told by the HP techs (previous to this call) that this noise level is normal when it's clearly not. The problem is that HP gets to decide what is 'normal'. 

I'll keep troubleshooting with HP, but I need to get some work done as well. If the issue isn't resolved in the next 10 days or so, I'm just going to bite the bullet and get a new backplane for better airflow. 

If it comes to that, I'll be trying my luck with Dell or Lenovo servers in the future.

[Oscar A. Perez]

The DL380e Gen you have is the "Storage" model that has parts that are not included in the standard (non-Storage) DL380e Gen8 model.

As I mentioned earlier, you need the entire Drive cage and Hood (not only the drive backplane). HP cannot send you parts from one submodel to make up another submodel because, those part numbers are not even listed as replacement items for the unit you have.

Try to return that unit as a whole and then, get the DL380e Gen8 base model plus the P420 card.

BTW, I was finally able to get ahold of a Primary Riser with SAS and I see no major difference with the temperature of the P420 card.  I was only able to lower the FANs to 33%.   Any lower FAN speed causes the P420 temperature to increase towards 90ºC.  

[fishy007]

It's been a few weeks since I contacted HP and it's taken them all that time to tell me that there's nothing they will do for me.

From their point of view, it's my problem as I should have known this before I bought the unit. Everything is working 'as intended'.  From my point of view, it's such a specific issue linked to 2 pieces of hardware that there was no reasonable way for me to know about the issue before purchasing. Furthermore, when contacted for help, HP didn't know about the issue either.

Also, according to HP's Level 2 support, the system isn't smart enough to know if the drive cage is fully populated or not. It runs the fans at a minimum of 35% for the possibility that the drive cage is fully populated. Even if the P420 controller is cool (50C or lower), it won't drop the speed of the fans.

Bottom line is that I will have to pay for a new SAS controller or new drive cage if I am to reduce the noise.  I'm truly disappointed with HP and I don't think I'm being unreasonable in requesting help from them.  I'm confident in saying that I won't recommend HP servers to my clients anymore. The support is quite poor.

[Joshcliffejones]

Hey Oscar and indeed all,

I just wanted to ask if it would be possible to lower the fan speed of the 3 system fans in an ML350 G6?

I currently have it as a home server which is awesome due to the power, scalability and reliability it offers. However it's bloody loud to have in an office!

I have tried changing the fans for other PWM fans and moddifying the fan connectors so that they register correctly, but despite iLO saying they are running at 25%, they appear to be running at full speed which is highly frustrating!

All temps within the server are good and all but 1 sensor report temperatures south of 45C, the ambient room temperature is 19/20C, so it should be sufficient.

Oscar, you mentioned that you used the iLO debug to manually change the fan speeds, how did you do this?

I hope that someone might have the miracle answer I'm looking for!

Thank you all in advanced!

Kind Regards
Josh

[Oscar A. Perez]

Josh,

I have a ML350 G6 with two processors and 4 fans and they are running at 13%.   How many processors do you have? Did both come installed or you installed the second proc later?  

I'm asking because, this unit has 4 different configurations, some of them for 1 Proc come with a small Baffle, some of them require a large Baffle.   Open the hood and look at the label.  

Also, check in the BIOS under Advanced Options->Thermal Configuration.  Mine is set to "Optimal Cooling".

[Joshcliffejones]

Oscar,

Thanks for the response, mine also has 2 processors installed (E5520) which were installed at the same time along with 3 fans. I have also tried adding a forth fan at which point they all then run at 21% instead of 3 at 25%, but it still seems overkill and noisy.

It has the latest BIOS, iLO and power controller firmware and the Thermal Configuration setting is also set to Optimal Cooling.

The system is running ESXi 5.0.0 Update 3 and is the custom image from HP for this server, but I have also tried Server 2012 R2 to see if running that with the latest drivers and software cures the fan speeds, but unfortunately it does not.

Any ideas?

Kind Regards
Josh

[Mike_Rus]

I have two servers 380e 668668 25 SFF with latest firmware and software.

These new servers is taken from warehouse after a half-year conserveation.

I see a 13-20°C from sensors during loading process. And then after temperature calibration severs set ON a supersonic fighter mode.

I created a tiket in HP support and send them AHS logs to analizing.

[Mike_Rus]

HP suport answered me with recomendation to move a cooler from 6 slot to first.

Server became quieter!!

Now i have 5 fans in 1,2,3,4,5 slots and 6 is empty.

[Oscar A. Perez]

I believe when I tested mine, I had all 6 FANs populated.

Since the P420 card inside that storage model requires a lot of air to remain cool, I would advice you to add an extra fan for slot 6.

[waaronb]

I hate to be "that guy" but in my experience with Proliants and also servers from other manufacturers, servers are power hungry noise makers. That's why we shove them into noisy server rooms with lots of insulation for the heat and noise. :)

I just checked some of my servers in one of our colos... they're all in the same cabinet with the usual hot/cold aisle setup:
DL360 G6: ambient =33C / fan speed = 61%
DL380p G8 (16 SFF): ambient = 32C / fan speed = 6% for 1-3, fan 4=36%, fan 5-6=45%
DL380 G5: ambient = 27C / fan speed = 48-54%
DL360 G7: ambient = 23C / fan speed = 38%

Not sure why that G7 reports a lower ambient temp. Weird. But at any rate, the fans do generally run fast across the different generations.

In fact it was only the G8 that had some of the fans running slower thanks to it's "sea of sensor" technology which really does try to get more airflow just to the places that would benefit.

And as noted earlier in this thread, thanks to the handy 3D view of the temps, it does get hotter over in that PCI card area. And my particular system has the 8-drive expansion so I've got the 420i plus an additional 420 controller installed, so it does get plenty hot back there in that corner. 85C for sensor 29-PCI-2.

But I only have these servers within hearing range for a short time while I configure ILO, and then it's off to the server room, well away from my head. And let's face it, when you're in a crowded colo with acres of servers, the noise of your puny system is lost like a drop in the ocean. :)

If your needs require quiet servers, I'd suggest something a little more home-grown like a desktop with liquid cooling, but if you wanted to be creative, take any of those gaming rigs and look at the heat pump designs with liquid coolers, and you could probably rig something up to get air into that back corner of the DL380 G8 where it's needed most.

You could even try something as simple as installing one of those PCI cards that's nothing more than some fans to blow air onto whatever. Usually used as additional GPU cooling in gaming rigs, but if gets a little more air going past a hot P420, that's not too different.

[VelocityTracy]

May I ask what OS you are running on these servers with the temp control issues?