Microserver Gen10 Plus and Intel Quick Sync

[bkp_duke]

Poured all over the tech documents for this new server, but still cannot find this info, so hoping someone here can answer.

If you install a Xeon CPU with built-in graphics, is Quick Sync enabled on the server and available?  This is a critical feature for Plex transcoding, and is why I ask.

I would be coming from a Microserver Gen8, and because there is a Matrox GPU chip on the motherboard, this feature is always off on this old server.

Looking to upgrade a home server that is used heavily for Plex, and this is a must-have feature in the new server I purchase.

[william hawkins]

I cannot tell you directly that this will or won't work because I don't know for sure -- you'll have to contact appropriate sales channels.

However from experience across the product line >10 years:  in general ProLiant ML/DL products are intended to be "Servers" not PCs or "Gaming systems"    So specifications and design for that market doesn't alway address every possible need or implement every function Intel (or AMD) throws into their chipset and firmware.   In Servers, typically the built in Video ports are intended only for use during booting and maintenance, rather than to drive some 4k monitor at 120fps while playing first-person-shooters.  Architectually the built-in video ports are thereby typically driven by the iLO chip hardware (aka HPE's built in BMC) rather than any Processor Chipset Video functions.  There is an extensive line of ADD-on GPU (PCIe based cards) which are supported to enable accelerated GPU assisted workloads and even drive monitors; sadly though likely not in the Microserver due to physical size, power and cooling -- "real" GPUs pull more power than this whole box. . . . 

[bkp_duke]

That was a pretty worthless reply.

If you knew anything about Plex Media SERVER then you would know transcoding is a critical component to . . . you know . . . SERVE data to the clients.  I, nor any one else running a Plex Media SERVER will be putting a monitor on a server like this for anything beyond initial configuration.

HPE is targeting this server to the SOHO/SMB group, and that puts it smack in the middle of the Plex clientelle, hence my question.

Sure, I could toss a GPU in there and transcode on that, but the on-chip Quick Sync is just as good or better at it (it's basically ASIC circuitry designed just for video transcoding), but that would piss away the only PCIe slot in the server, which thanks to the poor design of the motherboard and not having a built-on M.2 NVME slot, will need for a PCIe-based SSD.

[SanjeevGoyal]

Hello,

I hope all is well.

I would request you refer to the below MicroServer Gen10 Plus documents for more clarification.

HPE ProLiant MicroServer Gen10 Plus QuickSpecs

https://h20195.www2.hpe.com/v2/getdocument.aspx?docname=a00073554enw

HPE ProLiant MicroServer Gen10 Plus

https://h20195.www2.hpe.com/v2/gethtml.aspx?docname=a00073554enw

HPE PROLIANT MICROSERVER GEN10 PLUS

https://dustinweb.azureedge.net/media/541636/microserver-gen-10-plus.pdf

If you feel this was helpful please click the KUDOS! thumb below!   

Regards,

[bkp_duke]

Or course I read all the documentation before I asked the question.  I could find no reference there to an on-board GPU (my current Gen8 server has a Matrox).

Anyone else have some info?  First-hand experience would be fantastic if someone can report on perhaps what Windows Device manager shows.

[KevinSpringPM · Accepted solution]

Intel Quick Sync is not supported. Intel's SPS firmware doesn't allow it, and SPS is required for the server-y features of the microserver Gen10 Plus. This is used instead of the Intel ME firmware that you may be more familar with, which does support Quick Sync, but doesn't support server features. 

Source: I'm the DL380 Product Manager and asked the Microserver Product Manager

[bkp_duke]

Thank you, that's what I needed to know.

I do not see much of a reason to upgrade from my Gen8 at this time.  Perhaps if there was more than one usable PCIe slot, or onboard M.2 NVME.

[randman]

I had the exact same question. I also have the Microserver Gen8. I was thinking of getting the Microserver Gen10 Plus with the stock Pentium CPU and replacing it with the Intel Xeon E-2246G, which supports Quick Sync. If true, it's unfortunate that the Microserver Gen10 Plus can't take advantage of Quick Sync.

I also have an HPE ML30 Gen9 (Intel Xeon CPU E3-1240 v6 (3.70GHz)). I'm using a Plex ESXi VM on this ML30. Sounds like it won't be able to take advantage of Quick Sync either??

On my ML30 Gen 9, I'm using a PCIe card with an onboard M.2 NVMe. While using a PCIe with onboard M.2 NVMe is much faster than a SATA SSD, for my use, I probably can live with just using a SATA SSD. I guess a separate graphics card is another option that can be used for transcoding Plex. If so, wondering what would be a good graphics card and can be used on the MicroServer Gen10 Plus (or maybe even my old ML30 Gen 9)??

[bkp_duke]

I am strongly considering one of the new Intel NUC 9 Pro's.  I would have to move the current RAID array in the Microserver Gen8 into an external SAS enclosure, but it is only 4 x 10TB drives and I can move over the HP P212 array controller that way and not have to rebuild the array.

Downside is that the Intel NUC 9 Pro is in a totally different price category than the Microserver Gen 10.

With a NUC 9 Pro I could have a M.2 SSD (more than one, in fact), a CPU that does Quick Sync (or a dedicated GPU), an internal 500W PSU, a smaller case, and really lose nothing except the internal 3.5" drive bays.  I'm also intrigued about future expandability of that new platform.

[randman]

Yeah, Intel NUC 9 Pro has very nice specs, but as you said, an entirely different price category.  My HPE ML30 Gen9 so far has been doing its Plex duties just fine (I can direct play 4K just fine, and all my 4K videos also have 1080p counterparts for remote use). I use an external NAS for my videos.

If you were to get another server, a possible consideration is to continue to use your Microserver Gen8 to serve as a NAS

[bogwoppit]

@KevinSpringPM Oh that is such a shame , the microserver looked to be a perfect Plex home server.

I am curious about why Intel include QuickSync in the coffee lake Xeons at all (the G models with iGPUs). Xeons are server components so seems a bit misleading to list them as having this feature but with no intention to make it available for those platforms.

Is this also true of other HPE server platforms? I have been pondering whether swapping one of the 22XX or 21XX G processors into an ML30 gen10 would be worth doing for this reason. I know there is a matrox G200 onboard and this will be what is connected to the video out on the backplane, but does this mean that there is no benefit from the iGPU on these CPUs?

[randman]

Yes, I was wondering what would be the advantage of getting the Intel Xeon E-2246G (which supports Quick Sync) versus the Intel Xeon E-2236, which doesn't support Quick Sync. They're more or less similar in performance except the "G" processor supports Quick Sync. So, if the Microserver Gen10+ doesn't support Quick Sync, even though the prices aren't drastically different between the two CPUs, I don't see the advantage of getting the Quick Sync CPU. Unless I'm missing something....

[KevinSpringPM]

My 2 cents- Xeon Entry (the 2000 series) aren't "Xeons" for "servers" the same way that Xeon Scalable Processors (bronze, silver, gold, platinum) are. That's why it's a totally different product line from Intel, different features, different use cases, not really made for traditional servers, just the very entry level. If someone like qnap wanted to take a Xeon Entry CPU and drop it into a NAS for Plex, they could choose to take the ME firmware and enable Quick Sync, but then lose some server features, because no one really expects a qnap NAS to be a true "server". It's all about what the intended use case for the product is. So while I love that the community wants to use our servers for Plex, that's not really who HPE builds the servers for right? We have to support as many advanced error correction, firmware tweaks, etc as possible for our business customers first, so if we have to choose between advanced server features and Quick Sync, we have to choose in favor of that advanced functionality. 99% sure the ML30 Gen9 is the same, but you can pull up any server on support.hpe.com and see if it has an SPS firmware package available. If it does, then no Quick Sync.

If you still want to use a Microserver or ML30, I'd recommend adding a Quadro P2000 for acceleration w/ a Plex Pass. The Nvidia Shield can also do a decent job as a basic Plex server and doesn't require a Plex Pass to use the included Nvidia GPU for transcoding which is a nice quirk of Plex's licensing rules.

[dahamsta]

Intel Quick Sync is not supported. Intel's SPS firmware doesn't allow it

Would this preclude installing a low-profile video card (assuming one will fit?) with NVENC for hardware accelation too, or is it just Quick Sync? (Sorry if this is a silly question!)

[KevinSpringPM]

this is specific to Quick Sync. You can absolutely add a dedicated GPU

[dahamsta]

Excellent, thanks!

[bkp_duke]

@KevinSpringPM 

That's a really stupid way to look at it.

1) While this is my home server, I run datacenter operations for a company with 6 datacenters and purchase lots of gear annually.  Your reply doesn't exactly inspire me to even consider HPE equipment for our operations.

2) This server, by all appearances, is TARGETED AT THE SOHO market.  Despite that appearance, it has some significantly glarning faults: 
- it doesn't have a M.2 NVME slot (seriously?  in 2020 that was left off?)
- it only has one PCI-E expansion slot (most of us are not going to buy the iLO expansion card, so that slot is a complete waste)

3) and let's be clear here - most of the "stuff" you say you have to support is built in at the chipset level.  HPE just has to follow Intel's guidelines on implementation.  ECC has been around for over 20 years, not exactly something hard to implement.

I'll be going with an Intel 9 NUC Pro.  It's expensive, but it appears to be built reasonably future proof.  The Microserver Gen10 Plus appears to be backwards thinking and lacking many key features, both for the SOHO market, and for those wanting to use it outside of the "intended usage".

[KevinSpringPM]

we're not talking about features like ECC that we have to choose when implementing SPS. We're talking about things like Intel Node Manager, power monitoring, thermal capping, administrative core power off at boot time, etc that aren't available to implement at all if a vendor chooses not to implement Intel Server Platform Services. Intel is the one who makes this differentiation, there is no option for HPE or any other vendor to enable these features that business customers need, and Quick Sync at the same time.

[dahamsta]

I'm just about to buy one based on @KevinSpringPM's feedback, that was the one thing holding me back.

It'll be grand for my home server, there's no way I'd be lashing out twice the price or more for performance that of course would be lovely, but I simply can't afford just like that. I'm sure it'll be grand for many others too, Reddit's r/selfhosting and r/homelab seem keen, for example.

I realise you probably think you're being forthright, or perhaps woke, but your attitude just comes across as rude and ignorant.

[KevinSpringPM]

@dahamsta are you referring to @bkp_duke 's feedback and the NUC Pro, or to my feedback and the Microserver?

[dahamsta]

@bkp_duke's posts in general.

[randman]

Regarding @KevinSpringPM previous post - Like me, I think other folks looking to use an HPE ProLiant server to run Plex is precisely because of the HPE servers' advanced server features. I've worked in environments with hundreds/thousands of VMs running on ESXi and HPE servers. It was great being able to build software, and deploy and manage the VMs without ever actually having to be anywhere close to where the actual physical servers reside (in fact, all the HPE servers were hundreds of miles away).

To me, having IPMI access like HPE iLO is a must-have for servers, whether for work related or even for home use servers (especially for software that's not desktop-type software and especially for servers that's best kept out of site where space and noise is not a factor). IMO, Plex to me is a "server type" software, that's intended to run 24x7x365 reliably (or suffer the wrath of other household members), so I wouldn't want to run Plex on a desktop PC that other folks normally use or that's not as reliable. IMO, running it in a server that supports "advanced server features" is ideal. I've gotten spoiled by HPE's iLO and to me is a major plus in getting an HPE. Looks like the Intel NUC 9 Pro has vPro (haven't used vPro but looks like it could work for remote management). But the NUC is a lot more $$ than I'd like to spend at this time.

Having said that, being able to use Quick Sync would have been icing on the cake, but unfortunately, as mentioned, isn't supported :-(. Also a 6 core, 12 thread CPU option on the Microserver Gen10+ would be nice too. I noticed that VMWare's ESXi hardware compatibility guide has 2 line items for the MicroServer Gen10 Plus: a Xeon E-2200 4 or 6-core entry and  a Xeon E-2200 8-core entry. Hoping that a 6-core CPU option will be available as a stock model in the future. It's tempting to get the cheaper Pentium Gen10+ and replace it with the 6-core CPU, but that increases the price significantly. 

I agree, an M.2 slot would have been really nice to have. I wouldn't want to use up a PCI slot to hold a PCI card for an NVMe. Granted, I wouldn't use the Microserver as a storage device (I have external NAS's), so a plain old SATA SSD, while not as good in performance as an NVMe would be something I can live with.

@KevinSpringPM''s suggestion regarding the Nvidia P2000 is very intriguing (before then, I had looked at the Nvidia Tesla, and found the $$ too intimidating). I'm not aware of a half-length p2000 though, so unless there's a half-length version, it won't fit in the MicroServer Gen10+. 

I do have an HPE ML30 Gen9 though, which I actually use for running Plex on an Ubuntu ESXi VM (in addition to other VMs). I just noticed that the P2000 is actually on the HPE ML30 Gen9's officially supported list!!

The Nvidia P2200 is newer than the P2000 and has better performance in general than the P2000. Although the P2200 is not in the HPE ML30 Gen9's hardware compatibility list (not surprising since the P2200 is relatively newer), I don't see any reason why it wouldn't work on the ML30 Gen9, do you?

[KevinSpringPM]

True on size, I was speaking generically about the ML30 or Microserver, but the P2000 won't fit in a microserver gen10+, but the P1000 may fit.

[dahamsta]

Again pardon my ignorance, more of a software guy, is that because of height or length? I looked into cards earlier and saw a thread on Reddit about cards, and thought I could use a GTX 1650, but I'm not sure now. I assumed low-profile was low-profile, and that would be ok.

[KevinSpringPM]

it's primarily around height on the Microserver, the one general purpose PCIe slot is low-profile, so that's the immediate restricting factor that excludes the P2000. There are low profile 1650's and P1000's