What's the Difference between Timefinder and Timefinder Clone?

[Michael Steele_2]

a) What is timefinder?
b) What is timefinder clone?
c) Do BCV's work with both?
e) How are they different from each other?
f) What is an example of using Timefinder?
g) What is an example of using Timefinder clone?

Note: 2nd posting. I wasn't getting any responses from the Storage Forums. :-)

[Patrick Wallek]

It appears that Timefinder is the name of the product line and Timefiner/Clone is a specific product in that line.

http://www.emc.com/products/family/time-finder-family.htm

Perhaps Timefinder is a slightly older incarnation?
http://www.emc.com/collateral/software/timefinder.pdf

[Torsten.]

Hi Michael,

my very first google hit is

http://www.emc.com/products/family/time-finder-family.htm

Is this your topic?

Looks like a replicating solution. Sorry - don't know about such devices, but I know about the pointer based solutions (the VA family was already using this).

[Tim Nelson]

If I remember correctly.

The origional timefinder was the BCV functionality to create full volume replications typically for backups.

The clone product was pretty much the same but more like "snap" clones, where the copy was a snap of data These copies could be presented to test servers for r/w operations, as the data changed on the snap the differences would deminish between it and the origional.(e.g. old data read from origional/source disk, new data to snap is written elsewhere)

I think the idea was to reduce the need for additional storage for backup or testing.

Or at least something like that. I am sure the DOC on emc.com does a better job at explaining then I do .

[Torsten.]

This is exactly the "pointer based" idea - you say "I want to have a copy >>now<<" - and you got it in the same second. The system will just copy the pointer to the data. You read always from the original (as long as it is original), but you write into the clone to another storage area.

[Michael Steele_2]

a)?
b)?
c)?
d)?
e)?

[Torsten.]

Michael, because of your status you know certainly about the relation of quality of question and answers ... ;-)

Maybe you get better answers in a EMC forum, if exists.

I know nothing about this hard- and software.

(Still trying to be helpful ... I hope I can count on you if I need help someday)

According to the link above there is a clone and a snap - IIRC there was the same on early HP VA's and Compaq's EVA (and others too).

The snap will track changes and is accessible immediately, the clone will clone (copy) first and is available after the copy is finished (takes some time and needs space).

IMHO asking this question without telling about the hardware and other background will certainly assure a few or no answers at all ... so please respect our attempt to help you.

Don't take this too seriously and have fun!

;-)

[BUPA IS]

Hello
a) It is tool invented by EMC to allow you replicate disks on a DMX array at the array level so that you can "save time" by taking backups to tape from a point in time copy .

b) you do not mention the disk arrays but EMC snapclone is used for a similar purpose on the EMC clarion arrays but the mechanism is different .

c) bcv is part of the DMX implementation

d ?
e ) BCV (business continuity volume) is created in the DMX array by your engineer and is often not mirrored . A BCV group is set up by the administrator to map to the disks you want to replicate. You start a sync process in the disk array , once the sync is complete the replication process keeps both copies up to date. At a convenient point in time a split is issued and the second copy can be mounted on the same or different system. It is a complete copy of the data.
Brifley the clone process starts logging differences to the clone disk when the snap is issued. It can be mounted immdiately but the overhead increases in line with the change rate.

f and g

backup to tape while the real database is restarted and continues running.
more for BCV than snap though mount a copy for reporting .

I hope this helps please consult emc for full details

Mike