default protection and backup

[Willem Grooters]

I wonder what I missed: (VMS 8.2 AXP)

I have files created with a UIC-based protection (s:wred, o:rwed, g:re, w:), owned by SYSTEM. In a batch procedure run under a system account,these files are copied to another location using BACKUP:
$ BACKUP/LOG/BY_OWNER=
The destination directory has a default protection specified: (DEFAULT_PROTECTION,SYSTEM:RWEDC,OWNER:RWEDC,GROUP:RWE,WORLD:RE).

I expect that the UIC-base protection defined on the directory is used, but it seems that this DEFAULT_PROTECTION is bypassed, and the original UIC-based protection is copied.

[Wim Van den Wyngaert]

Without testing : /by_owner is a input or ourput aualifier. Did you place it correctly ?

Did you hacve sysprv or where you logged in as the owner ?

Wim

[Karl Rohwedder]

I can reproduce this behaviour also under V8.3/Alpha. I think, this is expected, for backup to produce an exact copy of the file.
Using the COPY utility in the opposite the new file takes the default protection.

regards Kalle

[Wim Van den Wyngaert]

Mmm, should read better.

Found no way of creating the files with backup and following the acl protection.

New for me (newbe in acl's) is that you can do your backup and do
$ set sec/def *.*.*.
This works but modifies the mod date of the files.

Wim

[Volker Halle · Accepted solution]

Willem,

try using BACKUP/INTERCHANGE

/INTERCHANGE is supposed to not copy certain file attributes (including ACLs).

And it will do what you expect it to do in your case. At least with V8.2.

Volker.

[Wim Van den Wyngaert]

I can confirm Volkers words for 7.3.
But note that acl's are NOT copied when using /interchange. And check help backup/int : I don't understand the first remark.

Wim

[Karl Rohwedder]

Normally BACKUP also treats all DIR-files, even if no file in them is selected to allow for a incremental restore (delete files which should be deleted). /INTERCHANHE skips such directories if they aren't selected by filename.

regards Kalle

[Wim Van den Wyngaert]

Karl,

Example of how to "select by name" ?
I always seem to get the empty directory too.

Wim

[Jan van den Ende]

Willem,

have you ever looked at a Backup output qual /BY_OWN=parent?

Proost.

Have one on me.

jpe

[Wim Van den Wyngaert]

Jan,

tested it. Doesn't work either.
BTW : set priv/def *.* preserves acl's copied by backup.

Wim

[Willem Grooters]

Thanks to all.
Some have appearently assumed ACL on the files themselves. That is _not_ the case: nor sorce, nor destination carry ICL protection. According the manula, setting a default protection for all files in a directory is to specify THAT directory with the given ACE.
Another point is that the creation date needs to be preserved (preferrably).

Karl: Copy is not a real option: it can concern a number of files in one go, and some files can be locked at the time of copy. BACKUP/IGNORE=INTERLOCK solves this issue - and since it are all sequential files used for reference only (log files, to be precise) I don't bother on missing data ;-)

Jan: The destination owner is _not_ SYSTEM, but an normal user (used for general puposes). That's why I put /BY_OWNER= on the output size. But others (WORLD) must be able to read them.

Volker: Might be the solution if the creation date/time is preserved.

I will implement the solutions this week.

[Willem Grooters]

/INTERCHANGE does the job, it even keeps the creation date. The inplied /CONVERT, causing loss of ODS-5 attributes, is no problem (file-spec is ODS-2-compliant)

[Willem Grooters]

Workable solution from replies