hyperterminal or analogue on OpenVMS

[Walter Miller_1]

Once you do the SET HOST /DTE OPA0: you should get a "connection established". You should be connected to your UPS and be able to send commands to your device (what you are calling terminal emulation). Only use the Ctrl/@ only if you want to get into the DTE command mode to make changes to your connection. To get out of command mode type "exit" and you should see "connection resumed" - this indicates you are back in terminal mode. If you are not getting a response from your device then your device is either not connected to OPA0: or your communication settings are incorrect.

[Alex Chupahin]

>Probably has something to do with who's doing
>the work.

You are right

>How did you know it was named "ttyS0"

It is standard name of RS232 port 0 from I386 to Alpha or Itanium architecture.
I guess OpenVMS should have like it also

>On my system, TTA0 is connected to a Sun
>Netra t1 105:

Is it mean, that if the same physical RS232 port will be connected to IBM RS system instead, it names just will be TTA1: ?
and then, reconnect to Switch Cisco pix it will be named as TTA2 etc?

> HELP.
....
>How hard and/or complex was that?

Still not understand what command starts terminal emulation.

[Steven Schweda]

Ok. A Google search (I should need to do
this?) suggests that a Jensen is actually a
DECpc AXP 150. Too old for me. I have no
idea how VMS handles its serial ports.

rx1620: Too new for me. Same problem.

When you tried "set host /dte OPA0:", what
happened?

Have you tried connecting pins 2 and 3
together to see if you're talking to the port
where you have the cable connected?

> In Linux on the same machine I can fairly
> quickly connect to the UPS via minicom or
> etc during a five or ten seconds.

And, as I've shown, I can do the same thing
in VMS with SET HOST /DTE, but I have a good
cable, I know where it's connected, I know
what VMS calls my serial ports, and so on.

[Hoff]

In classic OpenVMS terms, a package such as a minicom, the screen tool or such isn't directly available, and you'd end up installing a console package such as the old VAXcluster Console System (VCS) or such. There are a number of these listed in the OpenVMS FAQ.

http://www.hoffmanlabs.com/vmsfaq

Part of the confusion here (above and beyond the language issues) is likely that the folks here may or may not be familiar with minicom or screen or such.

As for the hardware, there's a difference between Jensen and rx1620 in terms of connectivity. The primary port available on these is the console serial port, and I'm not fond of using the console as a communications port. But it can be.

SET HOST /DTE OPA0:

If you have other serial ports, these can have various names. The easiest way is to connect a terminal to the port and log in and look at the device name.

Other options include any of the terminal servers or minicom devices at the remote end (nearest the device to be controlled), and you can use telnet to connect into a minicom, and connect from there to another system. If the target as a terminal server attached, it's network-based and you can use telnet or LAT for communications. And some UPS devices have network connectivity, which makes this easier.

I'd not normally expect to find a UPS device connected via terminal emulation, I'd tend to expect to see a program controlling it. There might well be a USB or serial line involved, but there's usually a need for host software.

This controlling program is often built from an $assign for a channel to the device, then $qio or $qiow to read or write from the target device, and glue logic. This approach assuming serial protocols or (on the rx1620) USB.

Some UPS devices work by toggling signal pins, not be serial character traffic. Signals can be monitored on some serial controllers, but far from all.

Brian Schenkenberger has a package available for specific UPS device models. Details on connecting to a UPS are in the OpenVMS FAQ.

I certainly would not rule out configuring a minicom server, terminal server, or a Linux or Unix box as a cluster console or such, if OpenVMS doesn't meet your requirements here.

Stephen Hoffman
HoffmanLabs LLC

[Steven Schweda]

> >On my system, TTA0 is connected to a Sun
> >Netra t1 105:

> Is it mean, that if the same physical RS232
> port will be connected to IBM RS system
> instead, it names just will be TTA1: ?

On my XP1000 (or on my PWS 500, or on my
AlphaStation 200 4/233), TTA0 and TTB0 are
the VMS device names for the two 9-pin serial
ports on the rear panel. These are the
names, no matter what you connect to them.

The serial port device names may depend on
whether there's a graphics display or a
serial console terminal on the system. They
may also depend on the system model, which is
why everyone tried so hard to get that datum.

> Still not understand what command starts
> terminal emulation.

And I _still_ don't know if you're using a
DECterm at a DECwindows display, or what.

A DECterm, or an xterm, or a dtterm, or an
hpterm -- all are terminal emulators. This
is not Windows, where you need to do
something unusual to start a terminal
emulator. Most VMS users always run some
kind of terminal or terminal emulator all the
time.

SET HOST /DTE (or Kermit) is how you get your
terminal emulator to talk to a serial port.

[Alex Chupahin]

>Once you do the SET HOST /DTE OPA0: you
>should get a "connection established"

Yes, I just see it:
$ set host /dte opa0: /speed=9600
%REM-I-TOQUIT, connection established
Press Ctrl/\ to quit, Ctrl/@ for command mode

Then do nothing. I should expect to see terminal emulation right here or not?

[Walter Miller_1]

Yes...if you are connected to the correct OPAx serial port you should be able to type any commands your device understands and see any output from your device.

[Alex Chupahin]

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
And I _still_ don't know if you're using a
DECterm at a DECwindows display, or what.

A DECterm, or an xterm, or a dtterm, or an
hpterm -- all are terminal emulators. This
is not Windows, where you need to do
something unusual to start a terminal
emulator. Most VMS users always run some
kind of terminal or terminal emulator all the
time.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

I'm using DECTerm from Xwindow. Yes, I understand that it is not Windows (BTW I dont use Windows at home/work since 2001 and totally forget about this OS)
I say "terminal emulator" meaning a program or mode to work through RS232.
So I would like to see an instruction how to connect anything through RS232.
I dont like Kermit very much and not like to learn tonns of keys and features I never need. I have no time for it - I'm mostly programmer, and I'm porting software to VMS. Not an administrator. But if I find an simple instruction how to connect devices I need via Kermit - I will use this megasoftware.

So about a first step.
When I connect via
$set host /dte dev:
should I see connect session to the device and can work on it?
Or not?

[Alex Chupahin]

>>>
Yes...if you are connected to the correct OPAx serial port you should be able to type any commands your device understands and see any output from your device
>>>>

Oh thank you very much for help...
Now I'm understand...
I see nothing - it is meaning I have bad cable/bad port settings.
Ok, I'll try later.

[Steven Schweda]

> So about a first step.
> When I connect via
> $set host /dte dev:
> should I see connect session to the device
> and can work on it?
> Or not?

Yes, as I showed in that Sun Netra example.

[Alex Chupahin]

Thank you hoff.

I get a bit of wisdom

>And some UPS devices have network >connectivity, which makes this easier.

UPS is for example. I wish to connect with Jensen various devices, rx1620 also.
BTW rx1620 has a one serial RS232 port under communication port.

[Alex Chupahin]

Thank you Steven

It seems I have a bad cable. I'll check it later.

[Steven Schweda]

> It seems I have a bad cable.

Perhaps. Or you're not connected to the
same port as you think. Or someone else is
using that port for some other purpose.
SHOW DEVICE /FULL dev:
If you have SHARE privilege (like SYSTEM),
you can SET HOST /DTE on a port which is
already in use, and that can confuse things,
too.

[Kelly Stewart_1]

Art,

> Sorry, a SHOW DEV TT doesn't show them for some reason.

The string "TT" has probably been defined as a logical name pointing to your terminal. Try "_TT" or just "T".

Kelly

[Andy Bustamante]

I'd recommend e-mailing info at Brian Schenkenberger's domain, tmesis com. He has VMS package which monitors APC UPS and can execute shutdowns if appropriate.

Brian also states on his web site, a standard cable won't work with an APC power supply. If you didn't get one you'll need to order one from APC or him.

Andy Bustamante

[Joseph Huber_1]

To clarify a few things:

On a Unix type system, You need a program like minicom, because the system does not have a built-in command like VMS SET HOST/DTE.

And minicom also does not know automatically which serial port to use, just uses COM1 by default (or whatever You or Yout system admin has saved as default). And yes, VMS unfortunately does not have a default.

So You have to find the port. OPA0 should NOT be used for that purpose! It is a 'software' device pointing to the console device, and depends on the workstation or server type of system.
On most Alphas workstation types, the 2 built-in serial ports are TTA0: (COM1) and TTB0: (COM2).
Since TTA0: can be used as serial console (after SRM command SET CONSOLE SERIAL), TTB0 (COM2) should be used to connect whatever devices.

Before using a port for communication, it must be SET TERMINAL TTB0: /NOTYPE_AHEAD - otherwise all unsolicited input on the port starts a login process (on Unix systems You have to kill a process, if the port was setup for login, usually nowadays it is not setup as such, therefore minicom can access it).
Also make sure the terminal speed and other parameters are set correctly, e.g.
SET TERMINAL TTB0:/SPEED=9600
SET TERMINAL TTB0: /NOTTSYNC
SET TERMINAL TTB0: /COMMSYNC
or
SET TERMINAL TTB0: /MODEM
See HELP SET TERMINAL for further settings.

When You have the correct working parameters,
put those SET TERMINAL commands in a command-file with the /PERMANENT option (eventually called from systartup
).

If Your keyboard doesn't have the default control keys for SET HOST/DTE like control-@, then define some other on the command line:
SET HOST/DTE TTB0: /command=A and enter control-A to get the DTE command prompt, similar for /BREAK and /ESCAPE (in minicom You have to know the command key as well).

Finally, as others have said, an UPS probably isn't behaving like a console port doing a dialogue in readable text. Assuming the correct wiring, You may have to write )or get) a specific program to communicate. On Unix, minicom also would be of little help in such a case.

[Doug Phillips]

Try OPA1 or OPA2 instead of OPA0, and try the other serial port using each of the OPA numbers, too. The Jensen didn't use TTA names. I don't know what names your rx1620 might use but I would suspect it would have TTA's. If not, use the OPA's.

The Hardware names of the devices can be seen from the console (before the system boots or when it's halted) >>> show dev

Once the Operating System is booted, it uses device names based on the device's handler (driver). VMS, Linux and Windows NT might (and usually do) use a different name for the same device. The Jensen can boot all three operating systems if properly configured.

As has been said, you should connect a terminal to the serial port and log into it. This tests your port, cable and the port settings.

Once logged in, enter SHOW TERM to see the OS's name for the port. This is the name you will use for set host/dte and all other references to that port.

You need to match the device-connected port settings to the device; baud, parity, start/stop bits, flow control, and what ever else the device needs.

See: help set term

If you aren't using a "real" terminal, you might need a terminal emulator on a PC or other non-VMS system to log into VMS, but once logged in you only need to logically connect that terminal to other devices. VMS doesn't itself need a terminal emulator, but you need to have a protocol in common with the other device, and the device's "language" must be compatible with the terminal.

Since you don't even know the name of the port or whether you're connected to the right one or what its proper setting are, unless you have a working system to swap cables with you might be premature in assuming the cable is bad.

[Alex Chupahin]

Thank you for all. I solve this problem:

1. It was bad cable. I'm using good one.

2. OPA0 cannot be used.
$set host /dte opa0:
leads to open local Jensen console
I use OPA1: instead.

Now all things is work.

Thanks for all once more

[Hein van den Heuvel]

>>> Thanks for all once more

Alex,

Say thanks with points!

Hein (0 points for me please.)

[Steven Schweda]

> 1. It was bad cable. [...]

I bet you wouldn't have had _that_ problem
with Linux. Things are so complex in VMS.

[Art Wiens]

An observation:

Isn't it odd that RS232 can still invoke this much "interest" in 2008? Wiki says it came about in 1969! ~40 years!!

9600 baud forever man!

Cheers,
Art

[Ian Miller.]

9600 baud! - you where lucky (launch into rendition of four Yorkshireman sketch)

[Hoff]

---
On a Unix type system, You need a program like minicom, because the system does not have a built-in command like VMS SET HOST/DTE ---

Most Unix boxes do have built-in commands.

Compared with the screen tool that shows up in many Unix distributions by default, SET HOST /DTE (in isolation) is functional, but also comparatively limited.

Here's how screen can be operated, for purposes of comparison:

# one-shot symbolic link command
# an alias for the serial device
# (easier for folks to remember)
# (akin to an OpenVMS logical name)
ln -s /dev/tty?? /dev/modem1


# launch screen
screen /dev/modem1

screen works like SET HOST /DTE combined with a reasonably capable console environment akin to the old VAXcluster Console System (VCS) package, with touches of the OpenVMS virtual terminal support.

Given Alex's likely familiarity with minicom and with screen and other such, his confusion is understandable. There's no particularly comparable equivalent in OpenVMS, short of acquiring and installing something akin to VCS or another serial terminal application.

A screen or minicom port to OpenVMS would be nice, but VCS and friends are the likely path in the interim. See the OpenVMS FAQ for some of the other available console management options beyond VCS.

[Alex Chupahin]

>I bet you wouldn't have had _that_ problem
>with Linux. Things are so complex in VMS.

1. I had no _that_ problem with this cable in linux for a month ago. Cable was good.
2. I dont know how set host /dte should looks like when working. I see only a message like "press ctrl/@ or ctrl/\ to exit". Of course, I press ctrl/@ and up to setting command shell. I look through it and find no any command to start session.
So my words should be clear I think.